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#16 |
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On Jun 5, 2:42 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> "bicycle_disciple" <1.crazyboy.o...@gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:a1059340-0fff-490a-82dd-40d89a8167e8@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... > > > > > I think you put that very well there. There is a segment of the > > consumer market which is composed of new people coming to bicycling. > > Most of them haven't ridden bikes before, leave along "serious biking" > > Some don't even know how to shift! > > Not to put too fine a point on it but there are few people too stupid to > learn how to shift in minutes. To imply that they need an automatic > transmission instead of a few minutes instruction is pretty whacky. This isn't about stupidity, Tom, but about the perceptions of potential customers. If they think shifting will be difficult, they won't even buy a bike. Therefore it is smart to introduce automatic gears for new bicyclists somewhere near the cheap end of the market. Second point: for those who fear derailleur shifting, there is the option of hub gears with a simple, single rotary control. Even simpler is the NuVinci with its continuously variable control. Third point, same as first: the problem with automating the 8sp Nexus and the NuVinci is that the necessary price puts the bike back in a market where potential purchasers will be people either with bike experience or those with the confidence to try anything and willing to bet they will succeed. (Even I first bought a manual Nexus and ran it for a couple of years for experience before splashing out on the electronic automatic version -- and I'm pretty electronically savvy.) In that case, the automatic bike must count on selling to technofreaks and maybe the terminally incompetent rich. How many of either class can there be? (Mind you, I know one guy who complained that his electric bike was too difficult to ride...) So an automatic bike must be cheap and appeal to new bicyclists -- of which there are potentially tens of millions -- to have a chance of surviving by creating a mass market. Andre Jute http://members.lycos.co.uk/fiultra/...%20CYCLING.html |
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#17 |
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"Andre Jute" <fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:e3088a2d-9c45-44cf-ada0-8de1210859b3@w8g2000prd.googlegroups.com... > On Jun 5, 4:00 am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote: >> "Andre Jute" <fiult...@yahoo.com> wrote in message >> >> news:42d0bc30-f71f-4798-a9a8-9e01b183c84c@b9g2000prh.googlegroups.com... >> >> > On Jun 4, 9:32 pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote: >> >> Do you suppose you gain anything by having an automatic transmission >> >> on a >> >> device that can usually be powered through a single gear? >> >> > What a curmudgeonly old luddite you are, Tom. Let the young man have >> > his dreams of making something, or making something better, or even >> > reinventing the wheel. Who knows, if we encourage him he might invent >> > something to make even you seem, by magic, as fast on your bike as a >> > young man. >> >> Andre, one of the problems is that too many people think "improvement" is >> "speed". > > Quite. I've said so many times before. But the problem is that many > cyclists, and many on this conference, do think that improvement and > speed are synonymous to the exclusion of any other equivalence, and > say so, or imply it by constant emphasis on weight. When I arrived on > RBT some posters showed the poor judgement of sneering at me as a > "recreational cyclist", for instance -- and what is opposed to a > recreational cyclist but one who is speedier? Bullies generally > believe that they act with the support and on behalf of the majority, > in short that their opinion is the lowest common denominator. > >>I don't want to discourage someone from inventing anything they >> want. But can't a good bicycle remain a good bicycle? > > I agree with you. No one should shackle up a thoroughbred to a cart > hauling corpses to the cemetery. > > But that isn't what this thread is about. This thread is about making > a comfort-bike even more comfortable. I, for one, define "improvement" > not as speed (though speed may come into it as a result of other > factors) but as greater comfort, greater ease of operation, more time > to enjoy being out in the open rather than paying attention to > shifting gears or keeping up cadence or proving something by taking > the lead on the steepest hills. You're throwing a bunch of apples -- > very well bred apples, true -- into a basket in which this young man, > and I, and Joseph and others, have placed only oranges. I mean, who in > his right mind will put a NuVinci CVT on these bikes: > >> Look KG241 >> Time VX Elite >> Colnago C40 >> Eddy Merckx EX Pro >> Basso Loto >> Raleigh CX >> Atala CX converted to a touring bike. > > It's a point I made to the OP already, when I discussed the > miscomprehension of their potential market by the designers of the > NuVinci -- they're in comfort bikes, not sports bikes, but they > demonstrate that they do not understand this by providing fittings for > a disc brake, for all the world as if they believe they're competing > against Rohloff... > > Andre Jute > http://members.lycos.co.uk/fiultra/...E%20HUMOUR.html And, in any event, how many of us aren't "recreational cyclists." I can think of professional racers, couriers and the odd rickshaw........for the rest of us it is basically for enjoyment (....even if I pretend the morning commute is about "efficiency/environment/time"......I'm sure that if I didn't enjoy it I'd soon be back in the car.) Hugh Fenton |
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