Training Qs: intervals, blowing up, fat...

Nobody

On Wed, 14 May 2008 01:34:26 GMT, Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com>
wrote:

>I'm just
>consuming way too many calories, and my theory is the best way to work
>that out is to just really work hard on avoiding the behavior that leads
>me to consume certain types of marginal (as in the extra 10%, not as in
>doughnuts) calories.

I would suggest getting a 'good enough' idea of how many calories you
are consuming versus how many you consume to not gain any weight.
(maintenance)

Theoretically, going only 100 calories over your maintenance every day
for a year is going to end up causing a weight gain of 1lb every 6
months, unless you're young. (all other things being equal).

It's not much food. Just one extra tblspoon of peanut butter above
maintenance, for instance.

That -could- translate to about 10-12lbs weight gain per year, esp if
you're over 35-40 and work desk..

If you're young and have an active job, you burn it off. If you go
from active job to sedentary, you start gaining.

To lose 1lb per week, you have to eat 500 cals/day Less. Or burn 250
more than you do now (riding for 40min), and eating 250 less, or 2.5
tblspoons of peanut butter less -every- day for a week.

(Usually fat -loss- is a bit slower than that, due to other factors.)

Also, you can't gorge on weekends, because you blow the week in
totals. What's hard is hunger tends to go up and
consistency/motivation comes and goes.

Nobody

On Tue, 13 May 2008 23:40:30 -0400, Nobody<nobody@nowhere.net> wrote:

>Theoretically, going only 100 calories over your maintenance every day
>for a year is going to end up causing a weight gain of 1lb every 6
>months,

Oops, that's every six weeks, not months. Sorry.

Ryan Cousineau

In article <r2nk24d49qiedjpaibft00ub3arbo0s93o@4ax.com>,
Nobody<nobody@nowhere.net> wrote:

> On Wed, 14 May 2008 01:34:26 GMT, Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >I'm just
> >consuming way too many calories, and my theory is the best way to work
> >that out is to just really work hard on avoiding the behavior that leads
> >me to consume certain types of marginal (as in the extra 10%, not as in
> >doughnuts) calories.
>
> I would suggest getting a 'good enough' idea of how many calories you
> are consuming versus how many you consume to not gain any weight.
> (maintenance)
>
> Theoretically, going only 100 calories over your maintenance every day
> for a year is going to end up causing a weight gain of 1lb every 6
> weeks, unless you're young. (all other things being equal).

When I was semi-serious about training 3 years ago, I used FitDay for a
few months to track my caloric intake. It was quite revealing, though I
was eating pretty well then.

I gave up on FitDay because the user interface stank.

> It's not much food. Just one extra tblspoon of peanut butter above
> maintenance, for instance.
>
> That -could- translate to about 10-12lbs weight gain per year, esp if
> you're over 35-40 and work desk..
>
> If you're young and have an active job, you burn it off. If you go
> from active job to sedentary, you start gaining.

34 and with a semi-active job. I have to get up and walk around the
campus to fix things.

> Also, you can't gorge on weekends, because you blow the week in
> totals. What's hard is hunger tends to go up and
> consistency/motivation comes and goes.

I have some idea of the triggers of overconsumption, and a big one is
boredom. I just try to keep busy to not eat.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

Kyle Legate

Bill C wrote:

> the multiple small meals and snacks, along with several aerobic
> activity sessions are the key to keeping the metabolism elevated.
>

You forgot to mention the ECA stack.

Howard Kveck

In article <rcousine-8832E1.18342513052008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:

> I have only two weaknesses that hamstring my diet efforts: portion
> control and impulse control. Also, I like beer, wine, and hard liquor.

My experience was that portion and impulse control were big (ahem) factors in me
getting sort of heavy (mid 190s, oy!) back in the '90s. I'd sit down and just eat
whatever was there. Hey, it was tasty food! As for impulse control, I'd be sitting
reading a book and have to go look in the fridge. Funny, the same stuff was there 20
minutes earlier. I figured out that I was doing it because of boredom. I was riding a
lot (250 to 300 miles a week) so I should have had caloric debt. Anyway, I tend to
eat less food now and certainly do a lot less fridge runs (probably almost zero). I
ride a lot less (probably half or two thirds what I used to) and I do still eat a
diet with a fair amount of rich food but my weight is much better (158 or so).

> I don't have a good idea of what to do long-term, most especially for
> off-season. The eat-whatever diet probably will be not too bad as long
> as I keep riding as much as I am, but it's quite clear I'm just
> consuming way too many calories, and my theory is the best way to work
> that out is to just really work hard on avoiding the behavior that leads
> me to consume certain types of marginal (as in the extra 10%, not as in
> doughnuts) calories.

I'd agree with that last bit. I don't think the odd bit of splurging on something
like a donut or ice cream is what causes the problems, at least it doesn't cause them
for me. Learning to feel satisfied with a smaller quantity of your main meals helps
you not do the eat until you can't fit any more in thing. Doing that helped me only
add 5 pounds or so in the winter and that came off really quickly.

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

joseph.santaniello@gmail.com

On May 14, 5:24*am, Nobody<nob...@nowhere.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 13 May 2008 12:56:58 -0700 (PDT),
>
> "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com" <joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >25lbs of flab gone makes a HUGE difference.
>
> >Someone (like a bodybuilder) who has excess muscle mass may find it
> >hard to maintain that mass while losing small amounts of fat, but a
> >fatso with a 25lbs spare tire isn't going to have a hard time of it.
> >I'm a fan of (relatively) high protein diets.
>
> >I lost 50-60lbs riding, and I am WAY stronger than I was then. Not to
> >mention way faster.
>
> >Joseph
>
> Good job, but too vague. IOW, if you were 350lbs and are now 290, I'd
> be skeptical of claims of 'faster', unless you consider going from
> 12mph to 14mph _on average_ 'fast'.
>
> But if you were 225 and are now 160, I'd agree.
>
> I also lost 50+ lbs, and am still riding about the same speed on the
> flats.
>
> What's your avg speed then vs now, if you don't mind saying?
>
> TIA.

I was someplace over 250. I was allergic to looking at the scale at
that point, so I don't really know. Probably 260 or so. I'm 205 now.
If I were some kind of pro, I'd be 195.

At our club time trial I averaged 28km/h when I was fat, now I am over
40km/h.

I am convinced that a high protein diet (Zone-like) helps keep muscle
and helps control appetite which I feel is critical to losing weight.

And the easy things like eliminating mayonaise from sandwiches, etc.
Use more mustard instead, for example. Sparkling water instead of
juice or soda. Plain yogurt instead of fruit yogurt, big salads with
no oil. The trick is to give your body what it needs to run, and to
rebuild, but cut out the handful of daily surplus calories. The daily
surplus that needs to be eliminated is only 2-300 kcal, if that. Those
can be trimmed without resorting to drastic measures, and without it
feeling like some kind of deprivation.

For an overweight person, there is probably only 30 seconds in each
day where they are overdoing it in the eating department. The trick is
to find those 30 seconds and change them.

Joseph

Donald Munro

Bret wrote:
> We still do that. Scratch the word "nearly". I wasn't going to give Ryan
> any drinking advice. That would be like giving Tom Boonen sprinting
> advice.

But maybe Ryan needs someone to give him a lead out.

Donald Munro

Bill Asher wrote:
>> Don't focus on pedaling at a higher cadence. Â*

Bret wrote:
> Chung will post a chart demonstrating the ineffectiveness of the red
> herring diet.

The cannibal diet is supposed to be good for cyclists.

Bill C

On May 14, 12:38*am, Kyle Legate <lega...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Bill C wrote:
> > *the multiple small meals and snacks, along with several aerobic
> > activity sessions are the key to keeping the metabolism elevated.
>
> You forgot to mention the ECA stack.

Never bothered with that stuff. I watched people fork out big dollars
for the stuff because it was in the magazines and get nowhere.
Drinking tea seemed to do as much for me as their "stack" was doing
for them, and I wasn't a complete twitch all the time. Thought about
it, especially since I had a ton of trouble building my arms, along
with the other chemical goodies, but it was never worth it to me. Way
too many nasty side effects, and you've really got no idea what's
actually in the stuff you're getting off the street, or up from
Mexico. If you're lucky it's just saline with something harmless to
make it burn a bit going in so it feels right. I can't remember the
name now, but one of the big time steroid busts turned out to be about
90% of stuff like that. Not a good thing for your customers to find
out.
Bill C

Bill C

On May 14, 1:11*am, Howard Kveck <YOURhow...@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote:
>
>
> * *I'd agree with that last bit. I don't think the odd bit of splurging on something
> like a donut or ice cream is what causes the problems, at least it doesn'tcause them
> for me. Learning to feel satisfied with a smaller quantity of your main meals helps
> you not do the eat until you can't fit any more in thing. Doing that helped me only
> add 5 pounds or so in the winter and that came off really quickly.
>
> --
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * tanx,
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Howard
>
> * * * * * * * * * * * * Whatever happened to
> * * * * * * * * * * * * Leon Trotsky?
> * * * * * * * * * * * * He got an icepick
> * * * * * * * * * * * * That made his ears burn.
>
> * * * * * * * * * * *remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

It's actually pretty easy to build allowances for that stuff into a
planned diet, and it seems to help avoid the binging and cravings.
Building in allowances for a couple of beers is pretty easy too since
they're not bad calories, just empty, and not a terrible amount of
them either, especially for a casual racer who's riding quite a bit.
I'd say you've got it pretty well figured out Howard. It's tough if
you're the only one eating trying to eat healthy in a house too. If
you don't kill each other, someone else eating the same way, and
keeping an eye on each other can be a huge help.
Just no way around it, until it becomes an ingrained, habitual
lifestyle, it's a tough gig to stick with. Once you know where the
pitfalls are, can estimate portions pretty closely, learn which
restaurants you can go to, etc...it gets a lot easier, just takes a
lot of work and dedication to get there.
Bill C

Steve Freides

"Ryan Cousineau" <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:rcousine-2A97A1.18044113052008@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]...
> In article <68ub35F2uh4cqU1@mid.individual.net>,
> "Steve Freides" <steve@fridayscomputer.com> wrote:
>
>> "Donald Munro" <fat-dumbass@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:4829d405$0$2984$ec3e2dad@news.usenetmonster.com...
>> > Steve Freides wrote:
>> >> In short, eat less, and find heavy objects and move them - in
>> >> addition to
>> >> continuing to ride your bike.
>> >
>> > And drink less beer.
>>
>> Absolutely, especially immediately post-training.
>>
>> -S-
>> http://www.kbnj.com
>
> For heaven's sake!
>
> Beer is WHY I engage in a sport with high cardio-training
> requirements.
>
> So I can drink beer!
>
> Dumbassess...
>
> PS: good advice, will consider.



<RAMBLE>

I have to admit I've never been much of an alcohol drinker, so not
having much isn't a big deal to me. Funny thing - I remember when my
wife and I were, 20+ years ago, traveling in France and Italy, and
drinking a liter of wine between us every night. You do get used to it,
no doubt, and if I drank more than the half a beer once every few weeks
I usually now have, I'm sure it wouldn't make me quite so much feel like
s#$% later. But the other side of that coin is that my exercise wasn't
a priority to me back then, and it is now, and there's a difference
between taking care of yourself well enough to be a tourist or ride a
desk the next day when you're 20-something and taking care of yourself
well enough to push yourself pretty hard athletically when you're
middle-aged and beyond.

For the record, that half a beer (yes, I know it's criminal not to
finish your beer - I have no defense) is Guinness Stout. I figure half
a Stout is worth one regular beer, anyway.

Last but not least, I am firmly convinced that, regardless of what sport
you enjoy engaging in, resistance training becomes more and more
important the older you get. I got by just fine without it until my
early 40's or so, and was a regular runner and swimmer as well. FWIW,
I was never a triathlete, I just enjoyed all three so I ran most days,
biked 2-3 times a week (your basic A level club rider, including a lot
of fixed gear), and swam 2-3 times a week. It was my wife who commented
that I was too skinny - she looked at me and said I had basically no
upper body muscle and was starting to get a little belly - that's when I
started to moving heavy objects, and weight lifting has been berry,
berry good to me since. I'm exactly the same weight I've always been
but my bodyfat percentage has dropped a few points and I still look like
a runner or bikie according to most folks, which is fine w/ me - no need
to look like an ironhead if you know how to lift to improve your
strength without encouraging growth in muscle size.

</RAMBLE>

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

Steve Freides

"Paul G." <carbide@egine.com> wrote in message
news:96f5e1b1-eaac-47a4-be0c-4eca675efde7@w4g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> On May 13, 10:35 am, "Steve Freides" <st...@fridayscomputer.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> In short, eat less, and find heavy objects and move them - in
>> addition
>> to continuing to ride your bike.
>
> Hmmnnn... move heavy objects... does getting out of my easy chair
> count? I guess I could strap my remotes to barbells too...
> Fortunately, I live in a cycling paradise, so continuing to ride my
> bike is easy enough...
> -Paul

As I say in my long, rambling reply to the OP, it ain't the same. All
kidding aside, you could do a lot worse than to find a big rock in your
back yard, pick it up, and move it a few times. Taking a sledge hammer
to an old tire, even the lowly pushup or bodyweight squat adjusted to
your strength level can help, e.g., I do one-legged squats and one-armed
pushups - no need for weights, plenty of strength training right there.
Hoisting $20 duffel bag, a heavy plastic bag inside that, and a couple
of 50 lb bags of sand dumped inside is another easy, low-cost way to get
stronger.

Steve "5'7", 150 lbs., 53 years old" Freides

http://www.kbnj.com

SLAVE of THE STATE

On May 13, 9:09*pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
> In article <r2nk24d49qiedjpaibft00ub3arbo0s...@4ax.com>,
>
>
>
>
>
> *Nobody<nob...@nowhere.net> wrote:
> > On Wed, 14 May 2008 01:34:26 GMT, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > >I'm just
> > >consuming way too many calories, and my theory is the best way to work
> > >that out is to just really work hard on avoiding the behavior that leads
> > >me to consume certain types of marginal (as in the extra 10%, not as in
> > >doughnuts) calories.
>
> > I would suggest getting a 'good enough' idea of how many calories you
> > are consuming versus how many you consume to not gain any weight.
> > (maintenance)
>
> > Theoretically, going only 100 calories over your maintenance every day
> > for a year is going to end up causing a weight gain of 1lb every 6
> > weeks, unless you're young. (all other things being equal).
>
> When I was semi-serious about training 3 years ago, I used FitDay for a
> few months to track my caloric intake. It was quite revealing, though I
> was eating pretty well then.
>
> I gave up on FitDay because the user interface stank.
>
> > It's not much food. Just one extra tblspoon of peanut butter above
> > maintenance, for instance.
>
> > That -could- translate to about 10-12lbs weight gain per year, esp if
> > you're over 35-40 and work desk..
>
> > If you're young and have an active job, you burn it off. If you go
> > from active job to sedentary, you start gaining.
>
> 34 and with a semi-active job. I have to get up and walk around the
> campus to fix things.

Oh good. I'll send you a list of things to fix on campus. (There are
some things that can't be fixed.)

> > Also, you can't gorge on weekends, because you blow the week in
> > totals. What's hard is hunger tends to go up and
> > consistency/motivation comes and goes.
>
> I have some idea of the triggers of overconsumption, and a big one is
> boredom. I just try to keep busy to not eat.

I had thought you could come down to Sonoma Co to do a wine tour. But
scratch that. It is high time for a meth lab tour of Humbolt Co.

William Asher

Donald Munro wrote:

> Bill Asher wrote:
>>> Don't focus on pedaling at a higher cadence. Â*
>
> Bret wrote:
>> Chung will post a chart demonstrating the ineffectiveness of the red
>> herring diet.
>
> The cannibal diet is supposed to be good for cyclists.

So is removing a testicle, but nobody suggested that either.

--
Bill Asher