Where the cyclists in America belong: back alleys, gutters andsidewalks

Dane Buson

In rec.bicycles.misc Pat <groups@artisticphotography.us> wrote:
> On Apr 26, 10:51*pm, Eric Vey <jun...@ericvey.com> wrote:
>>
>> And when people say, "Can't be done, there must be a better way" you
>> chime in with "Well I don't understand what the fuss is about, I don't
>> have any trouble."
>>
>> That's egotistical.
>
> The primary difference is that you (and others) keeps saying things
> like "if YOU lived..." or "if YOU did" or "people should..." or "the
> world would be better if..." and I say things like "I think that I
> will...".
>
> You think the whole world revolves around you and that other people
> should comform to your thoughts. I think that I like living how I
> live, living where I live and doing what I do. Liking my life doesn't
> make me egocentric -- if makes me sane. You think "I don't like such
> and such and people should change to correct it". I think that if I
> don't like such and such, either I change it or I change myself. It
> is because I think that you have the right to live as you like (within
> reason and the law) and I'm fine with that.

Quite so. I wouldn't particularly want to live where you do [1], but I
don't quite understand all the condemnation you get for liking to live
out in the hinterlands.

Do I think that the shifting economics of our times mean that it will
become less desirable to live farther out? Yes, I think it will, and I
don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. But I also think it will be
(or at least should be) a gradual transition spurred by economics and
changes in social norms. The exact same way we ended up with suburbs
and exurbs we have now.

[1] Being the glittering urbanite that I am.

--
Dane Buson - sigdane@unixbigots.org
Unfortunately, most programmers like to play with new toys. I have many
friends who, immediately upon buying a snakebite kit, would be tempted to
throw the first person they see to the ground, tie the tourniquet on him,
slash him with the knife, and apply suction to the wound. -- Jon Bentley

Pat

On May 12, 12:46*pm, Dane Buson <d...@unseen.edu> wrote:
> In rec.bicycles.misc Pat <gro...@artisticphotography.us> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 26, 10:51*pm, Eric Vey <jun...@ericvey.com> wrote:
>
> >> And when people say, "Can't be done, there must be a better way" you
> >> chime in with "Well I don't understand what the fuss is about, I don't
> >> have any trouble."
>
> >> That's egotistical.
>
> > The primary difference is that you (and others) keeps saying things
> > like "if YOU lived..." or "if YOU did" or "people should..." or "the
> > world would be better if..." and I say things like "I think that I
> > will...".
>
> > You think the whole world revolves around you and that other people
> > should comform to your thoughts. *I think that I like living how I
> > live, living where I live and doing what I do. *Liking my life doesn't
> > make me egocentric -- if makes me sane. *You think "I don't like such
> > and such and people should change to correct it". *I think that if I
> > don't like such and such, either I change it or I change myself. *It
> > is because I think that you have the right to live as you like (within
> > reason and the law) and I'm fine with that.
>
> Quite so. *I wouldn't particularly want to live where you do [1], but I
> don't quite understand all the condemnation you get for liking to live
> out in the hinterlands. *

Most people don't understand anything about "the hinderlands" like
that we have cars and can go to cities if we need to. Therefore we
have access to the same doctors and hospitals and malls and shows and
such. It's not like we have to hitch up horses to wagons to get
anywhere.

We also have TVs and cable and internet and such.

Most people also don't understand that lots of "vacationlands' are in
rural areas. I just live here year-round instead of for a week in the
summer.

But the most mis-understood thing is that we have everything here (or
within a reasonable distance or through e-commerce) that I want.
Okay, I don't have a 24-hour Sushi restaurant, but I don't WANT that.
We don't have a 24-hour grocery or 24-hour drug store, but so what. I
don't want Cheerios at 2 AM. There is everything you want, here. You
just end up wanting different things.

But I understand that this isn't for everyone. But I like it. But if
you like a city, good for you. You might want Cheerios at 2 AM. It
takes all kinds.


>
> Do I think that the shifting economics of our times mean that it will
> become less desirable to live farther out? *Yes, I think it will, and I
> don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. *But I also think it will be
> (or at least should be) a gradual transition spurred by economics and
> changes in social norms. *The exact same way we ended up with suburbs
> and exurbs we have now.
>
> [1] Being the glittering urbanite that I am.
>
> --
> Dane Buson - sigd...@unixbigots.org
> Unfortunately, most programmers like to play with new toys. *I have many
> friends who, immediately upon buying a snakebite kit, would be tempted to
> throw the first person they see to the ground, tie the tourniquet on him,
> slash him with the knife, and apply suction to the wound. *-- Jon Bentley- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Zoot Katz

On Mon, 12 May 2008 09:46:11 -0700, Dane Buson <dane@unseen.edu>
wrote:

>In rec.bicycles.misc Pat <groups@artisticphotography.us> wrote:
>> On Apr 26, 10:51*pm, Eric Vey <jun...@ericvey.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> And when people say, "Can't be done, there must be a better way" you
>>> chime in with "Well I don't understand what the fuss is about, I don't
>>> have any trouble."
>>>
>>> That's egotistical.
>>
>> The primary difference is that you (and others) keeps saying things
>> like "if YOU lived..." or "if YOU did" or "people should..." or "the
>> world would be better if..." and I say things like "I think that I
>> will...".
>>
>> You think the whole world revolves around you and that other people
>> should comform to your thoughts. I think that I like living how I
>> live, living where I live and doing what I do. Liking my life doesn't
>> make me egocentric -- if makes me sane. You think "I don't like such
>> and such and people should change to correct it". I think that if I
>> don't like such and such, either I change it or I change myself. It
>> is because I think that you have the right to live as you like (within
>> reason and the law) and I'm fine with that.
>
>Quite so. I wouldn't particularly want to live where you do [1], but I
>don't quite understand all the condemnation you get for liking to live
>out in the hinterlands.
>
>Do I think that the shifting economics of our times mean that it will
>become less desirable to live farther out? Yes, I think it will, and I
>don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. But I also think it will be
>(or at least should be) a gradual transition spurred by economics and
>changes in social norms. The exact same way we ended up with suburbs
>and exurbs we have now.
>
>[1] Being the glittering urbanite that I am.

Lately the public transit ridership has increased to the point that
it's getting hard to find parking near bus and train terminals.

Eighteen bikes can fit into one parking space for a car.

I'd venture most drivers live within cycling distance of the closest
transit terminus. Even with downtown parking being more expensive
than transit fares too many people still choose to drive.
--
zk

george conklin

"Zoot Katz" <zootkatz@operamail.com> wrote in message
news:bp9i24ll238vlkpsg75p7v9qqggr3eck5o@4ax.com...


> I'd venture most drivers live within cycling distance of the closest
> transit terminus. Even with downtown parking being more expensive
> than transit fares too many people still choose to drive.
> --
> zk

Most jobs are not on transit lines.

RicodJour

On May 13, 9:42 am, "george conklin" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
> "Zoot Katz" <zootk...@operamail.com> wrote in message
>
>
> > I'd venture most drivers live within cycling distance of the closest
> > transit terminus. Even with downtown parking being more expensive
> > than transit fares too many people still choose to drive.
>
> Most jobs are not on transit lines.

Ralph Kramden's was.

R

george conklin

"RicodJour" <ricodjour@worldemail.com> wrote in message
news:30e40899-ea6e-44b0-9708-11304f732a52@s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On May 13, 9:42 am, "george conklin" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> "Zoot Katz" <zootk...@operamail.com> wrote in message
>>
>>
>> > I'd venture most drivers live within cycling distance of the closest
>> > transit terminus. Even with downtown parking being more expensive
>> > than transit fares too many people still choose to drive.
>>
>> Most jobs are not on transit lines.
>
> Ralph Kramden's was.
>
> R

It was under the transit lines.

Pat

On May 13, 1:40*am, Zoot Katz <zootk...@operamail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 12 May 2008 09:46:11 -0700, Dane Buson <d...@unseen.edu>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >In rec.bicycles.misc Pat <gro...@artisticphotography.us> wrote:
> >> On Apr 26, 10:51*pm, Eric Vey <jun...@ericvey.com> wrote:
>
> >>> And when people say, "Can't be done, there must be a better way" you
> >>> chime in with "Well I don't understand what the fuss is about, I don't
> >>> have any trouble."
>
> >>> That's egotistical.
>
> >> The primary difference is that you (and others) keeps saying things
> >> like "if YOU lived..." or "if YOU did" or "people should..." or "the
> >> world would be better if..." and I say things like "I think that I
> >> will...".
>
> >> You think the whole world revolves around you and that other people
> >> should comform to your thoughts. *I think that I like living how I
> >> live, living where I live and doing what I do. *Liking my life doesn't
> >> make me egocentric -- if makes me sane. *You think "I don't like such
> >> and such and people should change to correct it". *I think that if I
> >> don't like such and such, either I change it or I change myself. *It
> >> is because I think that you have the right to live as you like (within
> >> reason and the law) and I'm fine with that.
>
> >Quite so. *I wouldn't particularly want to live where you do [1], but I
> >don't quite understand all the condemnation you get for liking to live
> >out in the hinterlands. *
>
> >Do I think that the shifting economics of our times mean that it will
> >become less desirable to live farther out? *Yes, I think it will, and I
> >don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. *But I also think it will be
> >(or at least should be) a gradual transition spurred by economics and
> >changes in social norms. *The exact same way we ended up with suburbs
> >and exurbs we have now.
>
> >[1] Being the glittering urbanite that I am.
>
> Lately the public transit ridership has increased to the point that
> it's getting hard to find parking near bus and train terminals.
>
> Eighteen bikes can fit into one parking space for a car.
>
> I'd venture most drivers live within cycling distance of the
closest
> transit terminus.

Maybe where you live, but not where I live. Don't really know. Don't
really care. It isn't an issue for me. Even if I lived in a place
that had transit, what's the big whoop. I work out of my house so I
have the ultimately short commute. But as I said, if you want to live
in a city and commute back and forth, I'm happy for you. It's just
not my cup of tea.

Even with downtown parking being more expensive
> than transit fares too many people still choose to drive.

"too many choose"? By who's standards? Not all of the people who are
driving. Let them live their lives too. You and I only have say over
our own lives, not other people's (with the law, yada yada yada).

> --
> zk- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Clark F Morris

On Tue, 13 May 2008 06:49:38 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
<ricodjour@worldemail.com> wrote:

>On May 13, 9:42 am, "george conklin" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> "Zoot Katz" <zootk...@operamail.com> wrote in message
>>
>>
>> > I'd venture most drivers live within cycling distance of the closest
>> > transit terminus. Even with downtown parking being more expensive
>> > than transit fares too many people still choose to drive.
>>
>> Most jobs are not on transit lines.
>
>Ralph Kramden's was.

Depending on where the garage is, or when the first run for the driver
is, that bus driver might have to take a car or taxi to work.
>
>R

Jym Dyer

>>> Most jobs are not on transit lines.

=v= Only where transit is insufficient.

>> Ralph Kramden's was.
> It was under the transit lines.

=v= You're thinking of Ed Norton. Which brings us to the
Subject: line, at long last.
<_Jym_>