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HOP Progression

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Old 02-02.-2008, 04:14 AM   #16
Steve_B
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Black
DRIVE FOR THE LINE
- 10min. warm-up;
- 20min. @85% of FTP;
- 5min. @70% of FTP;
- 5min. @100% of FTP with last 30sec. thereof @140%+ of FTP;
- 5min. @70% of FTP;
- 5min. @100% of FTP with last 30sec. thereof @140%+ of FTP;
- 10min. cool-down.
Bill, What is the IF you get from this?
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Old 02-02.-2008, 06:14 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Black

I have plenty of others if you are interested -- a number involve motor-pacing on the Computrainer (drafting on and sitting in then...)

Best,
Bill Black


Those sound cool. I've done a few rides where I just manually adjust the pacer to keep it interesting and in Zone 4 (it'd be great in real life if after I got dropped I could just hold down the - key for 5 seconds to catch up), but I never came up with a specific workout protocol.

One thing I do periodically is draft behind the pacer on a flat .8km course (15 or more laps), and sprint every few laps. Then I save my performance, and do the course again drafting behind myself and doing the same thing. I've never saved a third or fourth time, but eventually you'd have trouble passing your own leadout!

Anyway, that's my attempt at trying to provide an idea or two in the hopes that you'll share your motorpacing workouts
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Old 02-02.-2008, 06:37 AM   #18
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Default Re: HOP Progression

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Originally Posted by Steve_B
Bill, What is the IF you get from this?

I don't pay all that much attention to intensity factor -- rather I look at improvements in wattage over the longer term (month to month and season to season) -- but I would say that I generally am .92+ or so for an IF.
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Old 02-02.-2008, 07:26 AM   #19
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Default Re: HOP Progression

These are very cool ideas...I have never tried it this way.

I always do it as a full hour at one wattage...I had never thought of changing it up this way. I like the Drive for the Lone one...will try this weekend.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Black
Here are three of L4/5 workouts that I like and find diverting as well as effective:

DRIVE FOR THE LINE
- 10min. warm-up;
- 20min. @85% of FTP;
- 5min. @70% of FTP;
- 5min. @100% of FTP with last 30sec. thereof @140%+ of FTP;
- 5min. @70% of FTP;
- 5min. @100% of FTP with last 30sec. thereof @140%+ of FTP;
- 10min. cool-down.

4.5 THEN DRIVE
- 10min. warm-up;
- 70% of FTP then every 4.5min. go @140% of FTP for 90sec. (so total of 6min.) and that is one rep and you continue that for 10 reps (total of 60min) never letting things go below the 70% of FTP base level;
- 10min. cool-down.

DRIVE FOR 5
- 10min. warm-up;
- 5min. @110% of FTP then 2min. @60% of FTP and that is one rep; do 3 reps per set and 2 sets with 10min. @ L2 between the sets.
- 10min. cool-down.

TERRIBLE 20's
- 10min. warm-up;
- 20min. @90% of FTP with last 2min. thereof being @110% of FTP and that is one rep; do 3 reps with 5min. @ L2 between the reps;
- 10min. cool-down.

I have plenty of others if you are interested -- a number involve motor-pacing on the Computrainer (drafting on and sitting in then...)

Best,
Bill Black
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Old 03-02.-2008, 12:23 AM   #20
Bill Black
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by ctgt
Those sound cool. I've done a few rides where I just manually adjust the pacer to keep it interesting and in Zone 4 (it'd be great in real life if after I got dropped I could just hold down the - key for 5 seconds to catch up), but I never came up with a specific workout protocol.

One thing I do periodically is draft behind the pacer on a flat .8km course (15 or more laps), and sprint every few laps. Then I save my performance, and do the course again drafting behind myself and doing the same thing. I've never saved a third or fourth time, but eventually you'd have trouble passing your own leadout!

Anyway, that's my attempt at trying to provide an idea or two in the hopes that you'll share your motorpacing workouts

The motor-pacing workout I do most often is to sit-in on the pacer at a wattage level (for the pacer) where I can just hang on by solid mid-L4 for me and then every 5min. I will surge and pass the pacer and then look to get back on -- a solid 60min+ is a good hard workout and keeps one engaged. Quite a few variations but this one is simple and easily comparable to prior similar sessions (i.e. log the watts of the pacer).

Best,
Bill Black
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Old 03-02.-2008, 04:01 AM   #21
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Black
The motor-pacing workout I do most often is to sit-in on the pacer at a wattage level (for the pacer) where I can just hang on by solid mid-L4 for me and then every 5min. I will surge and pass the pacer and then look to get back on -- a solid 60min+ is a good hard workout and keeps one engaged. Quite a few variations but this one is simple and easily comparable to prior similar sessions (i.e. log the watts of the pacer).

Best,
Bill Black
hmmm ... I really like the sound of that one Bill. I've not ever used the pacer with drafting turned on but I can see this one would work. Around what % over FTP do you need to run the pacer to get into mid L4 power level? Or do you adjust that on the fly?

And what does this have to do with the Super Bowl anyway?
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Old 03-02.-2008, 04:06 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by rmur17
hmmm ... I really like the sound of that one Bill. I've not ever used the pacer with drafting turned on but I can see this one would work. Around what % over FTP do you need to run the pacer to get into mid L4 power level? Or do you adjust that on the fly?

It is very easy to adjust the pacer (5W increments up or down on handlebar unit) so it is best to do it on the fly and that also gives you a chance to get a warm-up and a sense of how close to stay to the pacer (the draft effect dissipates the further you are off his wheel).

And what does this have to do with the Super Bowl anyway?

Excellent question but believing in jinxes, I will not provide any guidance or prediction on that.

Best,
Bill Black
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Old 03-02.-2008, 04:15 AM   #23
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Black
Excellent question but believing in jinxes, I will not provide any guidance or prediction on that.

Best,
Bill Black

fair enough - just keep the fingers crossed
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Old 21-02.-2008, 04:02 AM   #24
Ade Merckx
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Hey Bill, gotta say thanks for the tip on the HOP with two minute surges. I call mine '40mins of Fitness' since I tend to do it as part of a 3 x 20 session. Its a good feeling to surge deep into vo2max/MAP/L6 territory create a little damage for 15-25secs and come back @ a notch under threshold. Yeah I love em ...unlike my L5's of course
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Old 21-02.-2008, 04:08 AM   #25
Bill Black
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Originally Posted by Ade Merckx
Hey Bill, gotta say thanks for the tip on the HOP with two minute surges. I call mine '40mins of Fitness' since I tend to do it as part of a 3 x 20 session. Its a good feeling to surge deep into vo2max/MAP/L6 territory create a little damage for 15-25secs and come back @ a notch under threshold. Yeah I love em ...unlike my L5's of course

Happy to help -- those are very effective. One of the keys to successfull road racing is to be able to race at L3 and attack/respond at L4-6. Doing those surges and then returning to and holding a base wattage level that is a little uncomfortable and right on the edge of being able to recover at, is a great way to train/adapt the physiology.

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Old 21-02.-2008, 04:27 AM   #26
Ade Merckx
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Black
Happy to help -- those are very effective. One of the keys to successfull road racing is to be able to race at L3 and attack/respond at L4-6. Doing those surges and then returning to and holding a base wattage level that is a little uncomfortable and right on the edge of being able to recover at, is a great way to train/adapt the physiology.

Best,
Bill Black
Indeed, I've even started to a hold a good aerodynamic position for 3-4 mins in various stints through the workout. I've noticed on group rides that a few of the RR guys who perhaps have 20watts more than me available aren't the most aerodynamic. So I'm gonna keep working on keeping a flat back and equalising things up a little
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Old 13-03.-2008, 02:13 PM   #27
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Just wanted to drop in real quick and mention the awesome base that is realized with SST intervals and 20-30sec "sprints" every couple minutes. I've only averaged 4.5hrs/wk since the end of November (including a week at 13.5hrs for a 3-day training camp). Most of these hours were doing this simple workout -- I cannot stand to do anything else. My FTP increased quite a bit (10%) in the past 3 months, despite the limited load.

I refused to do short intervals on the trainer as it just seems like a waste...but this one workout is golden. I usually do it for 1.5-2hrs, 3x/wk.
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Old 13-03.-2008, 09:55 PM   #28
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Default Re: HOP Progression

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Originally Posted by iliveonnitro
Just wanted to drop in real quick and mention the awesome base that is realized with SST intervals and 20-30sec "sprints" every couple minutes. .

what % of FTP is SST? 90?
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Old 13-03.-2008, 10:27 PM   #29
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what % of FTP is SST? 90?
Training Zones Comparison
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Old 14-03.-2008, 01:22 AM   #30
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Default Re: HOP Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Black
Alex, my comeback is nothing compared to your own. I am in awe of your positive mental outlook -- you truly inspire me.

As to your question, that is a good one and it caused me to look at the WKO+ log from yesterday and NP was 315W same as avg. power for the HOP. I also checked the HOP I posted to the Wattage archives from March 6, 2007 and NP was 341 same as average power.

I supposed the reason NP ends up equalling AP is because I never stopped pedaling and NP adjusts mostly (wholly?) for gaps in pedaling.


Nope.
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