Power Quest 4 the 2busy

Simone@Italy

Do you care to elaborate a little how do you execute over/under FTP intervals?

kopride

This is a carmichael (CTS) workout that I have modified a bit. They are 2 separate sets of 12 minute intervals with a ten minute recovery between each set. Each set is 1 minute "over" at 115-120% FTP (RPE of 10) and 2 minutes "under" at 90% of FTP (RPE 7-8) x 4 for the 12 minute set. There is no recovery between the over and under. You are basically doing 24 total minutes of intervals within an hour, 8 x 1 min @ L5 (L6?) and 8 x 2 min @ L4.

I find that there is a great deal of variability within the 1 minute "over." My first few "overs," I am pushing into the 350-375 range. Eventually, I am settling into "overs" of 315-325, and my last one can be as low as 295 for the second set. My FTP is about 270. I will download my latest and give you the exact numbers but I am much more conscious of the wattage on the unders and basically go as hard as I can on the overs. The goal is to basically go as close to all out as you can on the overs, and then settle back into just below time trial pace. It is a killer workout and simulates the kind of riding you need to do in a short race, brief pulls and sprints to hang on, followed by fast pack riding. It is also very time efficient. A ten minute warmup and ten minute cool down plus the two sets (and the ten minute recovery) gives a total workout of 54 minutes. 6 minutes to fill your water bottle, put a good show on the TV and get your shoes on and you are done your workout in an hour. If you stretch for 5 minutes, afterwards it is still pretty close to an hour.

Simone@Italy

Thank you, I'll give it a try. As far as I can understand, you are doing it on indoor trainer, right? Could this workout be useful to raise FTP too, or is it just limited to crits/short races tuning?

kopride

Most of my "training" is indoors. When I ride outdoors on the weekend, it is usually longer tempo rides with buddies for fun. I am a big fish in a small pond with this group so I can usually dictate the pace. In this over/under workout, you are still riding two relatively long intervals (12 minutes). During the winter when I was really focused on FTP base building, I was doing more SST 2 x 20s. If you look at what SOT was doing during the tail end of his It's Killing Me thread, he was "pulling" his FTP by spending some time above FTP. it worked for him.

I will tell you, these shorter harder intervals do drop down the 2 x 20 averages once these types of workouts are thrown in. I seem to need a longer recovery time than a traditional 2 x20 SST workout, and have a harder time keeping it in the higher range of the SST if I throw a 2 x 20 in the mix too soon after a hard over under. For example, I really struggled yesterday trying to complete two SST 20 minute intervals. I am also doing a lot of bodyweight pistols as part of some other fitness goal I am working on, and I think I am a bit overtrained.

As I said, a big part of my goal is to get the maximum benefit in basically three one hour weekday cycling sessions and some bonus time outdoors on the weekend. My obstacles are work time, family, and my macho desire to try and still do regular strength building workouts. I have basically switched over to a bodyweight routine (as opposed to weights) but it still takes its toll (as does the cycling affect recovery and progress in the strength building).

Simone@Italy

I see.. too bad, because I hate those longer intervals

BTW, am I the only one who noticed that with bodyweight training, althought not directly useful for cycling, the recovery time has improved?

bigbadwoulfe

Any updates on this thread? Kopride how's your training going?

kopride

I am doing great. FTP estimate is about 280, but I need to do a full one hour TT. I am actually getting in more riding in as the weather cleared the past month. A typical week lately has been M: 1 x 30 @ 252; 1 x 10@ 255; T: 2 x 20@ 238; W: weight workout; Th: 2 x 20 or 5 x 5 L5; F: weights; weekends, long tempo rides with my buddies, and usually another short weight session.

I need to get out and do a one hour TT, but the weather has been pretty good so we have been doing some longer hilly rides on the weekend. I just don't have the mental state to hammer a one hour TT indoors.

I have not been racing or doing group rides as was my goal this year. My kid's sports and end of year school activities are wrapping up this week so maybe later this summer, but I think that I will see close to 300 FTP by September.

Jeff Vader

Try Mullica in mid-July. http://www.bikereg.com/events/register.asp?eventid=6700

Its the perfect race for first-timers.

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Cake or Death?

kopride

That does look like fun and I might be in Avalon that weekend anyway. I have 4 kids so it will depend upon whether my wife wants to hang with 4 kids solo. I used to ride with the Beacon group and I recall South Jersey is very flat and fast. Rolling seems to be a slight exxageration so I would imagine that it will be tight paceline all the way since there are few hills to break the packs up?