Iban Mayo

snood

No the problem is with spanish cycling federation. Same as with operation puerto and Valverde. Spanish federation wanted so bad to find Iban innocent that they contacted lab before investigation was finished. Then they proclaimed Iban innocent without authority.

Bro Deal

The UCI should eject the Spanish cycling federation and all its riders. If their federation is not going to get serious about doping then the sport would be better off without them.

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"You are like the wind and I like the lion. You form the tempest. The sand stings my eyes and the ground is parched. I roar in defiance but you do not hear. But between us there is a difference. I, like the lion, must remain in my place. While you like the wind will never know yours." -- Mulay Hamid El Raisuli, Lord of the Riff, Sultan to the Berbers, Last of the Barbary Pirates

Bro Deal

This is probably aresult of the sanctioning process. A sample tests positive. The positive get communicated to UCI. The UCI informs the rider's national federation. The federation officially notifies the athlete. The athlete and his representation have a certain amount of time to respond. They respond that they want to have the B sample tested. A time is negotiated to test the B sample such that representatives of the athlete and the national federation can be present. B sample is tested. Test results go to the UCI and the national federation; maybe instead of going to both at once, it goes to the UCI which then informs the federation.

During any communication with the athlete and his representatives there is probably a time loss. Perhaps something something is mailed and once received the athlete has a week to respond. Do this a few times and you have a large delay.

On top of this there must be many opportunities to delay the process once the lawyers get get involved. Landis' case was stretched out over a year mainly due to his delaying tactics.

There should definitely be a streamlined process with set deadlines. The length of Landis' and Hamilton's cases seems absurd. If Hamilton would have been cleared by CAS, he would have already served 3/4 of his suspension. Landis is on track for the same thing happening, especially if his suspension is rolled back to the end of the 2006 Tour.

__________________
"You are like the wind and I like the lion. You form the tempest. The sand stings my eyes and the ground is parched. I roar in defiance but you do not hear. But between us there is a difference. I, like the lion, must remain in my place. While you like the wind will never know yours." -- Mulay Hamid El Raisuli, Lord of the Riff, Sultan to the Berbers, Last of the Barbary Pirates

Frigo's Luggage

The UCI and the national federations should have nothing to do with dope testing or sanctioning. There is too much of a conflict of interest. There should be a separate body created for the judical function in these cases. WADA should do the testing and prosecution.

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We are all made of stars.

cyclingheroes

In some countries that has already happened...

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Trev_S

The actions of the UCI just make it appear that they want to make the whole existing doping mess even sloppier than it already is.
What happens if the French do retest the 'B' sample and find a negative result, will the UCI accept it then? and what if they say it's positive?
Opens up a whole can of drama's no doubt Mayo would fight it with 2 negative (or inconclusive?) results. I would imagine that then would be an easy enough defence but like other cases take way to long to sort out.

Is this just another case were the UCI want another scalp to make things look like they are being cleaned up?

limerickman

The UCI, and any national cycling federation, cannot be permitted to hold a dual mandate.
Dual manadate being the promotion of the sport and governance of dope testing.
Historically the UCI (and the nat.federations) had a mandate for both.

This is the crux of the matter for me.

It seems that under this dual mandate the sport allowed itself to create a doping culture.
The tolerance of doping served the UCI and national feds well........it allowed artificial performances to draw in wider TV audiences, which lead to more advertising potential, which in turn attracted more sponsors.

The UCI (and the various national federations) cannot serve two masters.
If the UCI wants a clean sport (and I dispute that the UCI do, in fact, want a clean sport), it must divest itself thoroughly of any input in to the testing process.

Dope testing must be independent of any interference from UCI/national feds.

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.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets" - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

cyclingheroes

Agreed.

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wolfix

Exactly...... The sport itself has fed off the glory of the difficulty of the TDF and to a lesser degree the smaller races. Historically the TDF has to be the most demanding event on the human body. When people become aware of the TDF the first thing they ask......."They ride how far?" Of course the riders are not riding at threshold the entire 3 weeks, but it still has it's intense demands.
This in my opinion has lead to the governing bodies to allow the doping culture to flourish over the past 100 years. However, the TDF & cycling would not be that great of an event if it was not demanding.
Then we have doping in every sport. Cycling is just one that has seemed to take the heat.
Last week a guy I am doing a project with showed his stash....... HGH, a different type of roid I have never seen, and a clear liguid juice that is refrigerated is injected for recovery. He is not a competing athlete, but a some type of martial art guy.
I do not see a solution to cyclings problems. I really do not think the average fan cares as long as it is being covered up. The cycling powers know this......... couple the intensity of the sport with the nationalistic glory and you have the formula for cheating.
A seperation of the doping powers and the organizers would make it far more difficult though. And that's what the fans want, they want the sport to clean up the other countries other then their own countryt programs.
But the doping powers have to a agenda that is not politically charged to be effective. WADA was not.

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limerickman

I think you've highlighted the probem.
Can the sport ween itself away from doping?
I have my doubts, given that doping appears to be so ingrained.

Does the average fan care?
On a superficial level, probably not.

But - when sponsors start leaving the sport, because they don't want their product associated with dope, the knock on effect will be that the sport will get less coverage and the fan will ultimately not get to see the sport.
Then the fan might actually start to care.

__________________
.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets" - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

whiteboytrash

Now, following the meetings in Paris Monday and Tuesday that saw the likes of the International Cycling Union (UCI), World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) and Tour de France organisers ASO taking part, cycling's governing bodies hope to have found a solution to confine those damaging doping affairs to the past.
That solution is a biological passport, primarily focused on testing the blood but also urine of cyclists throughout the season to monitor any irregular biological changes happening in the cyclist's organism.

It's a complicated affair but as of January 1, all cyclists will be obliged to carry such a passport, the introduction of which will result in a significant increase in the number of tests carried out by the UCI. Compared with this year, next year shall see an increase in in-competition tests from 5,590 to 8,000 and out-of-competition tests from 1,000 to 7,000. There will also be an increase in the number of blood tests before races, although the exact figure has yet to be confirmed.

"The biological passport is an individual document, which records all the results of biological analyses carried out on each rider (at present, haematological parameters and urinary steroidal profile)," said the UCI on its website. "All this data, once collated, enables the haematological and urinary profile of a rider to be produced, and thus, to monitor with precision the evolution of the various parameters in his body in comparison with his constant references."

The passport will concern all riders racing for Pro Tour teams and also other continental teams that qualify for wildcards in UCI Pro Tour events.

This has been described as a major breakthrough for a sport that is so tainted by doping that sponsors have been withdrawing, afraid of having their brand associated with cheating, media outlets have refused to broadcast major events and spectators have been tuning out.

Maybe this move has come too late but what is notable is that the previously warring parties have come to an agreement, something that has not often been the case in this sport.

"Everyone has willingly come to agreement. Two months ago it was a long way from likely," said Patrice Clerc president of ASO.

Now a new chapter has begun in cycling, time will be the test of its success but in a sport that can ill afford any more doping scandals, time is not on its side.

cyclingheroes

Sounds familiar... I heard that somewhere...

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earth_dweller

Agreed.

Fans don't want to know or believe that their favorite rider could dope. Look how hard folks are still defending Armstrong or the FLandis flock. I don't know why some fans seem to wrap up their own personal selfworth with their favorite athlete and that is wrapped up in nationalistic fervor - pretty scary stuff to then admit that your rider could be a cheater. A lot of so called discussions on bards do bring up xenophobe statements left & right.

I don't think that doping can be eradicated from the sport. I think it will get worse next year with more scandals, more infighting between all the orgs.. And then the light will dawn that this publicity is bad and everything will be swept under the carpet until the next time a police action finds doping stuff linked to cycling.

Bro Deal

I am not so sure about this. I cannot speak about European countries, but the U.S.--perhaps Germany is the same--has seen a significant change in the sport over the last ten years. In the U.S. cycling used to be much like climbing. It was a fringe sport. Now it has largely changed into a sport of yuppies who ride for fitness, and they do care about the doping.

I usually ride a few organized centuries a year. I have definitely seen a change in the type of riders. A large number are now sporting their companies' MS150 jersey. The riders used to be all sorts of odd ball characters and now they are almost all people with white collar jobs, often in their thirties and forties. The MS150 has used a rather brilliant strategy of encouraging medium and large companies to form teams of employees, and I think it has skewed the makeup of the average rider in the U.S.

I have lost track of the number of people I have bumped into on rides who have sworn off following pro cycling because of the doping. It has really picked up in the last two years. Wolf will say they don't matter, they were not long time, hardcore fans anyway; but I think it makes a difference. You cannot see a storying about doping in sport without cycling being mentioned. It has entered the popular imagination that pro cycling is as dirty as it comes.

All those yuppies are the ones buying expensive gear with their credit cards and HELOCs. They are the ones who sponsors are trying to connect with. If you lose them then the big money sponsors will leave. This might very well be why Disco could not land another sponsor.

With the cat being out of the bag, I don't see that you can now sweep the doping problem under the rug and go back to the way it was. There needs to be some sort of proactive solution that convinces people that things have changed.

__________________
"You are like the wind and I like the lion. You form the tempest. The sand stings my eyes and the ground is parched. I roar in defiance but you do not hear. But between us there is a difference. I, like the lion, must remain in my place. While you like the wind will never know yours." -- Mulay Hamid El Raisuli, Lord of the Riff, Sultan to the Berbers, Last of the Barbary Pirates