It's killing me but..........

Sillyoldtwit

Well young Curlew, that's a pretty comprehensive report.

Isn't there a gym near you with a trainer where you can get a comparison with the figures you quote?
Mind you, I doubt very much whether I coud do a 40km TT at 20.4mph average. although RD will probably say you can.LOL
Also I see you do mainly 30 minute intervals which is quite impressive; for the most part I do 20 minute intervals - maybe it's time I upped it.

Anyway Curlew you've inspired me to keep the pressure on. I can't have young whippersnappers like you licking at my heels!


RD wrote:


Or down it if it's too hard.

Now, who was it who suggested a target of 200W by the 15th of May?
I seem to have forgotten his name.

Just to annoy you - my target was 2x20 @ 250W in time for June the 4th.
Well, that's changed now to 2x20 @ 260W

Btw, you mentioned tapering in the final week before the Century.

I thought of doing a longish ride the Sunday before (120/130km)

Wed: 1x30 @ whatever Wattage I can do at the time. Followed by 1x30 @ 200W.

Then sleep until Sunday!

RapDaddyo

At this point, what is beginning to matter more is your 5-6 hour power (which is probably somewhere between 200-225W) and your 5min power (for short climbs). But, life goes on after June 4, so continuing with your 2x20s at increasing power is a good idea.

That'll work. It's really about total stress of the week before and the week of your long ride. I know how much you have fallen in love with TSS at this point. I'll work up a TSS estimate of your long ride week and get back to you.

Sillyoldtwit

This gave me a good laugh; it seems like only yesterday you were saying
"now do 2x20 @ 130W" !!!

Seriously though, the above brought home to me just how long I'm going to be out there. According to people I've spoken to, the course is no pushover climbing through all those mountain passes. I want to get to the finish ASAP.
So to take as little time as poss, I'm going to have to do some serious drafting to bump the average up to around 25kmph plus.

Tyson

Incidentally, do the VO2X intervals at a high wattage make the 20min intervals seem easier for a given wattage? At the moment I feel they do, although that is not the reason for doing them I know.

RapDaddyo

Interesting how this whole training thing works, isn't it? Structured training is about structured adaptations. You have been stressing your body is very specific ways and your body has adapted to the stress.

If your goal is shortest elapsed time, two things will help. First, drafting on the flat and downhill segments is huge and will reduce the power required at that speed by ~30%. Second, climbing at above your sustainable power. Climbs are where the physics/physiology relationship argues for more power. So, let's say you draft on the flats and downhill at 175-200W, which is equivalent to 250-285W. Then, you will have some reserve power for the climbs. So, let's say you climb at close to your FT (240-250W). That would be a very efficient use of your sustainable power for the duration of the event (~80-85%FT).

Yes, they have both a psychological and a physiological effect. The psychological effect is that after doing them for awhile you learn to relax at that power whereas initially you probably got all nervous and panicky at that power. The physiological effect they are having is that they are increasing your VO2MAX, which is one of the two parts that determine your sustainable power (FT for short). Your 2x20s determine how much of that potential you can actually use. IOW, you can have a high VO2MAX and still have a relatively low FT. Some athletes (e.g., Andy Coggan) have an incredibly high ratio of FT to VO2MAX (power).

Sillyoldtwit

Interesting that. My 2x20s power and VO2MAX seem to be running pretty close to each other, or at least they were. Tomorrow will tell, on Sunday my 2x20s were nigh on 250W, the same as the VO2MAX power only a few days before.
Theoretically as you say, I should be able to do at least 20Watts if not more, over and above 250W.

RapDaddyo

Well, the classic rule of thumb for VO2MAX adaptation is 120%FT, so if your FT is truly 250W you would do your 5min VO2MAX intervals at 300W. Didn't you say you were salivating at becoming a member of the 300W club?

Sillyoldtwit

This get's worse! Why don't you just say 350W and kill me off completely.

RapDaddyo

Now you're talking.

Sillyoldtwit

I'm off to bed RD. Talk to you tomorrow after the gym.

TYSON

RapDaddyo

Here' my estimate of your current weekly TSS.
2 days of 4xVO2MAX intervals + 1x20 @ 91%FT: 176 TSS points
1 day of 2x20s @ 100%FT: 71 TSS points
Sunday ride ~3hrs @ 85%FT: 216 TSS points
Total week: 463 TSS points

If you do 2 days of 2x20s (e.g., Mon Wed) the week of your long ride, the worst case scenario (century = 6 hrs @ 85%FT) is as follows:
2 days of 2x20s @ 100%FT: 142 TSS points
Century (6 hrs @ 85%FT): 432 TSS points
Total week: 574 TSS points

So, your total stress the week of the century is only ~25% greater than a typical week and is well under, say, one of my typical weeks. Not bad at all, really.

Sillyoldtwit

Today I received a sharp reminder that I haven't had an easy week since I started this caper back in January.

Walking up a slight slope to the gym, I knew beforehand that today was going to be a disaster.
Started off @ 270W, but after 3 mins was spent and did the last 2 mins @ 220W.
After a 5 min rest managed to squeeze out 5 mins x 250W, however, it was 10 times harder than the 1x20 @ 250W I did 2 days ago. Then did 2 mins at 200W and that was that! Kaput!

So for the rest of this week I'm going to "take the bike for a walk", and you'll be pleased to know you'll probably hear little or nothing from me until next Tuesday when I fire up again.

Btw, RD I appreciate your calculating my (little ambitious) figures, and I intend to spend this easy week brushing up on the maths behind training - TSS etc.

RapDaddyo

It was smart to throw in the towel early. You changed your weekly routine last week. I know about the mid-week ride, but what did you do the rest of the week and weekend?

Good idea, but I doubt you will need the entire week to get back to your routine. I'm guessing two days off the bike will be sufficient.

Sillyoldtwit

After last Tuesday's session in the gym, I took 2 days off as I usually do before heading for the mountains. So Friday was the 93k ride. Sat off and Sunday was the 250W interval session as laid out above.

RD wrote:


Has your soul no mercy?!?!

RapDaddyo

It's interesting. I actually have a completely unfounded theory (WAG) about the consequences of changing our workout pattern. It may be entirely psychological, but I think we may adapt to certain patterns and a change in the pattern can throw us off. I actually hope to explore this issue at the ride level on important rides. For example, a non-flat 40K TT would have an optimal power management plan, based on grades and normal wind conditions. Would one's performance in the race be improved by practicing the specific power management pattern in advance?

I'm not pushing you, I'm just predicting withdrawal symptoms.