It's killing me but..........

Sillyoldtwit

RD, have you ever checked out your past lives? Perhaps you have French blood and were around at the time of Marie Antoinette. The executioner maybe. or perhaps you were the resident torturer for Attila the Hun.
If not, where do you think you inherited your sadomasochistic perversion from?

The forecast is heavy rain for Sunday, so that sounds as good a time as any to do the V02 Max test (after 2 days rest). I take it that as you don't mention cadence, it is irrelevant.

Just one question - how if at all will this affect my overall power?

Oh, one more. After I've done this test will I be able to do anything else in the gym that day, bike or otherwise?

curlew

Tyson,

The 1X30 @ 200 watts is a breakthrough. Congratulations.

RD, when you have a minute, could you decribe the adaptations that result from these "VO2Max intervals" and the connection of these adaptations to the development of a rider's "anaerobic capacity." In earlier posts I think you have described the benefits of intervals @120%FT as developing anaerobic capacity. I guess from the name of the interval I would expect V02Max intervals to promote aerobic capacity, adaptations that increase the amount of oxygenated blood delivered to muscle tissues. Instead V02Max Intervals seem to promote adaptions that increase one's anaerobic capacity.

Tyson I am looking forward to your reports as you progress through this phase of your training. These reports put a very human face on the physiology and are something I look forward to reading.

RapDaddyo

I think Paul "Bear" Bryant may be a distant relative.

Cadence is whatever cadence feels most comfortable to you. My pedaling style is that I focus exclusively on the downstrokes, from ~1-5 o'clock. With a cadence lower than ~90, I get frustrated waiting for the upstroke leg to get into the "firing" position (1 o'clock) after I stop pushing with the other leg at 5 o'clock (if that makes any sense). But, you may be more comfortable at a different cadence (higher or lower). Toward the end of the test, it will require your full concentration to maintain power, so you don't want a cadence that you find annoying or frustrating. Experiment with different cadences at 240W.

Oh, this should increase your power significantly, unless your VO2MAX is already at its max. And, it will begin to tap a largely separate energy source, your anaerobic energy source. It will take slightly higher intensity intervals to fully train your anaerobic energy source, but that's another booster for efforts > FT (e.g., climbs). Think of what you have been doing as working on the cake and this begins to put the icing on the cake. Oh, and the cake isn't done yet either.

You'll be good as new within 15 minutes. It's actually harder mentally than physically, maintaining your power that last minute, trying with all your might to avoid a power drop that you know is inevitable. The last digit on the stopwatch seems stuck in the mud in the last minute of a max duration test at any power. But, this may not even drive your HR to its max.

RapDaddyo

120%FT is targeting VO2MAX (oxygen delivery) more than anaerobic capacity, but there is definitely some benefit to anaerobic capacity. VO2MAX is the upper end limiter of aerobic efforts, with aerobic efficiency being the other factor that determines FT. Anaerobic capacity is actually a separate (partially renewable) energy source, the components of which are adenosine triphosphate (ATP) and creatine phosphate (CP). The sweet spot for targeting anaerobic capacity is a bit higher power (e.g., 120-150%FT) and, obviously, shorter durations (e.g., 30sec-3min). Anaerobic capacity is also highly trainable.

It's not obvious on the surface that there is all that much difference between the target power levels for VO2MAX and anaerobic capacity training. But, when you take away what I call the "free" power (~100W), the difference is huge. Think about it for Tyson. His FT is 100W of work and 100W free. So, 120%FT (240W) is 140W of work or 40% more than his FT. That's huge. And, every 10W is another 10% of effective work. So, if he does his anaerobic intervals at, say, 260W, he will be working at 160%FT from an effective work perspective.

Sillyoldtwit

RD wrote:


I fully understand what you're saying there. On Tuesday when my legs felt like lead and I couldn't up the cadence, things just got worse - every stroke was a physiological and psychological drain. As you say, I was waiting for the pedal to reach 1 o'clock each time. I think if you experience something like that, it's better to get of the bike and play croquet or something.



Iow, after the test just spin a light weight for 10 or 15 mins, then do some intevals @ FT80/90% or similar, so as not to waste a training day.


I have a general question now, and would welcome answers from different quarters. With my 100 miler coming up in about 5 weeks or so, I am already planning things. As it is a 2 hour drive and the OFF is at 8am (registration @7.30) I aim to drive up the night before and sleep in the car. (big car) For breakfast I'm taking a large bowl of mixed cereals soaked in water over night, and before the off shall munch a couple of bananas.
Now, I've done a couple of centuries in the past, surviving on just 3 or 4 bananas (nothing else), but this 100 is a whole new ball game. It starts at a ski resort at 3000feet and then roller coasts it's way down to the lake taking in 3 mountain passes at between 2000 and 3000 feet (and several lesser climbs) Along the top of the lake it's flat of course, then up we go again taking in 2 more passes before reaching the Japan inland sea. After circumnavigating a peninsular (maybe flat) we then climb from sea level back up to the ski resort and finish.
I plan to take 3 power bars and 2 or 3 bananas, one bottle filled with plain water, and one with ???? any good ideas?? There will probably be drink stations on the way; no info yet. As per usual I don't aim to stop for more than 5 or 10 minutes, so have I planned enough grub?
One final thing - salt! When I was in my 30s I was lying well clear in 3rd place in a field of 200 in a marathon - suddenly I hit the wall at 22 miles and got cramp in the calves, later analized as lack of salt. End of race!
The same thing happened to me last October around the 80 mile mark on the bike going around the aforementioned lake. Luckily it happened within spitting distance of a convenience store, so I rushed in, nay hobbled in and bought the saltiest snack I could find, gobbled them all up and fully recovered to finish the course. Anyone else have lack of salt problems and what do you do about it?

Now, I know sustenance for a Century has been discussed in these forums, but this is a notorious Century, and the temperature is expected to be around 30c (86F) with high humidity. I only have one shot at it and I want to get it right.

Thanks in advance. TYSON

Sillyoldtwit

Sorry Curlew, I missed your post completely. Thanks for the congrats, but really RD should be congratulated for getting his protege to that level through his help and guidance.
I'm glad you find this thread useful. Although I'm always laying out my progress, I'm sure other "lurkers" are also finding it beneficial and applying the advice given. Just glad none of them live near me!


RD Wrote:


And apologies to you too RD. I missed this post, and I'm still trying to fully understand what you're saying. These anaerobic intervals at 260Watts you mention - I assume I've got these to come soon.

I'm thinking of buying some iron boots to help with the down stroke.

RapDaddyo

I'm saying that the way we characterize power relative to FT understates the true differences. Take, for example, VO2MAX intervals at 120%FT. On the surface, this appears to be 20% more power than at FT. But, think about it for a moment. The first 100W is virtually zero effort -- just sit on the seat and turn the pedals over and you'll do 100W. So, if your FT is 200W, that's 100W for free and 100W of work. Likewise, 240W is 100W for free and 140W of work. 140W is 40% greater than 100W, so in terms of real work 240W is 40% greater than 200W and that's a huge difference. Does that make sense?

Oh, come on, quit trying to get ahead of the program. By the time you're doing 260W intervals, your 200W intervals will be boring.

I don't know about the iron boots, but some powerful CO2-powered pistons that you could strap to the back of your calves would be nice.

Sillyoldtwit

RD Wrote:


After reading it again I get it. IOW 50% of the 200W involves very little effort. The other half is where the work effort comes in. So by doing 240W the percentage increase is based mainly on the 2nd half. Quite a difference!

Sillyoldtwit

Sorry RD didn't get round to doing my V02max test today. Woke up at 4.30, checked the weather and by 5am I was on the road. I increased the distance today, 2 weeks ahead of schedule. Up from 75km to 85km.
10 km doesn't sound much, but after the 6km climb I found a hairy scary narrow 4km twisting downhill. I ended up in a steep valley in the middle of nowhere with nothing but a few farmhouses and rice paddies. After about 1km, I then had to climb again for 4km (9-12%) to get back on my old course.
Pretty tired tonight but satisfied!
Will do the V02max test on Tues in the gym.

RapDaddyo

You did better than I. I rode in an 80-mile non-competitive event on Saturday. But, the local clubs always send their best guys to the front and the pace gets pretty brisk. I stayed with the lead group the first hour, but got dropped when they accelerated hard after a stop light. I chased for another half hour and picked up a bunch of dropees, but never got back on. After two hours, both of my quads cramped (too few hours on the bike the last few months), so finished the ride with my quads almost fully seized up. Sometimes when my leg got to the bottom of the downstroke I wasn't fully sure it would come back up again (LOL). But, I survived. Increasing your distance in anticipation of your big ride in June is a good idea. It really will be all about pace. Too bad you don't have a PM. That would make it easy.

Sillyoldtwit

Rd, it looks like I'll have to alter your training regime - got dropped?!?!?

We're going to have to introduce some sprint training into your workout, arrange a heart and lung transplant; thinking about it, maybe we should just transplant your old body.

PS You'll be pleased to know I've lost another kilogram. I'm not eating less, have just cut out donuts, cakes and chocolate. Also stopped my intake of caffeine, that is, coffee and diet coke. I find when I have a coffee I need a donut to go with it.
Also I never mentioned this before, but because I was drinking so much coffee and coke my pulse was really irregular. When finally 3 weeks ago it became - 1,2,3 stop, 1,2,3 stop ad infinitum, I thought enough is enough! It took 2 weeks to get the caffeine out of my system or at least the effect of the caffeine, and now my pulse is as regular as clockwork. TYSON

RapDaddyo

Yup. No matter how much power you have, somebody's got more. The accelerations were ~500W. Those empty one's matchbook in a hurry.

Nah, more hours in the saddle will do nicely.

Sounds as though you got your wife on board your new fitness regimen. Congrats. You'll feel the absence of those kilos on the climbs, big time.

Sillyoldtwit

No, not at all - sheer willpower and thinking about June 4th and hammering my cycling partner!

Looking forward to the vo2max test tomorrow - I think!

Regimen? Did I say regime? Must be the discipline playing on my mind. Something like the Hussein regime. Think I'll give up my job as a proofreader; can't even proofread my own stuff. But then on the other hand I don't pay myself for proofreading my own scribing.

Sillyoldtwit

Just one hour away now from doing my first vo2max test. I feel like a child about to open his birthday presents.

Is this normal? At the moment everything seems like a new adventure. I suppose this euphoria will wear off after a while.

I guess I'm feeling elated because I'm not a young buck, and doing things on the bike (or will be doing) I never dreamt were possible.