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04-12.-2005, 08:34 AM
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#46 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Great Smoky Mountains, TN USA
Posts: 6,570
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Quote:
Cin cin. 
__________________
Sobriety is over rated! |
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04-12.-2005, 08:38 AM
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#47 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,819
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
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The Israelis in general are not a cult, but the Zionists are.
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The media is a self perpetuating publicity stunt. |
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04-12.-2005, 10:04 AM
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#48 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 544
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Quote:
Calling Israelis' Zionists is like calling Catholics' Vaticanists.
__________________
"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing." Sir Edmund Burke |
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04-12.-2005, 11:08 AM
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#49 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,534
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Quote:
No, it is not remotely similar. If you are taking medication, you are taking too much. Best wishes for your recovery. Talking of too much medication : time for me to sleep well in preparation for a brute of a hangover. |
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04-12.-2005, 11:24 AM
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#50 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 544
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Quote:
Think about things when you are sober, please. Sobriety has a way of making one see clearer and not resort to name calling when your number is up.
__________________
"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing." Sir Edmund Burke |
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04-12.-2005, 01:06 PM
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#51 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,819
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
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Read #48 again. I didnt say that.
__________________
The media is a self perpetuating publicity stunt. |
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04-12.-2005, 01:17 PM
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#52 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,819
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Quote:
To my knowledge there is no such thing as a 'Vaticanist'. Please explain. We await in expected wonderment. You are such an adherent that you don't even know what a Zionist is. You married out. You don't keep Kosher, along with the rest of your family, and you write vaarkenvlees, or naknik hazir in Hebrew, and no doubt eat it as well.
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The media is a self perpetuating publicity stunt. |
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04-12.-2005, 09:09 PM
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#53 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,534
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
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Your statement is still bollocks in the cold light of day. *IF* you are taking head medication I suggest you redice the dose. |
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05-12.-2005, 05:48 AM
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#54 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Staffordshire
Posts: 4,816
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Lim, I will go so far as to say that out of the three of you, I find you to be the most rational. I'm well aware what your views are with regard to Israel as you have outined these several times over. This is basically your own opinion and, so far as I'm concerned, we live in a free world where people have the right to a particular viewpoint.
Fine, you personally dispute Israel's right to re-take land and displace the Palestinians. I, on the other hand, believe the hollocaust brought about a crisis situation whereby the Jewish people were justified for going on the offensive. It doesn't matter who agrees with whom. This land was the subject of dispute between the Arab States and Israel in the same way as the Falkands was disputed between Britain and Argentina. In such cases, countries may choose to go to war and this is what happened. Israel and the Arab States went to war and Israel won that war. Thatcher likewise went to war with Argentina and won her own war. There is a saying in Latin -"Ius Belli" or the law of war. How many countries do you know apart from Israel who occupy territory on the basis of war? I know of no such precedent where the losers of a conflict should have some kind of a right to dictate terms to the winners of a conflict. This would be like Hannibal trying to tell Rome how to conduct itself in Africa after Carthage had already lost that war. It doesn't happen. Quote:
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05-12.-2005, 06:13 AM
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#55 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,534
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
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Very easy for you to say that Crappy when it's not you and your family getting shot and frog-marched off their property by a bunch of IMMIGRANTS. You keep whining about a Arab/Muslim invasion by immigration, yet you have absolutely no problem with Zionists displacing millions of people from their homes of thousands of years in another country. Your point of view is fundamentally inconsistent. |
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05-12.-2005, 06:31 AM
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#56 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Staffordshire
Posts: 4,816
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Maybe Israel should have adopted the same tactics as your country and driven the Palestinians out altogether so they wouldn't be able to retaliate or protest? At least that's what happened to the Agentinians - there are none left on the island at all. You yourself pointed that out.
As Don Shipman hinted before, it's not Jewish people who are colonising Europe but Middle Eastern Arabs. The ethnic majority of major cities of the U.K. and France will be moslem not Jewish within the next few years and we'll be a less toerant society as a result. This wouldn't be a problem if those particular immigrants accepted western norms and ceased trying to impose militant Islam within European borders. But, as expereince has shown, whenever these people don't get their own way they set fire to cars, buildings and anything within reach, fully aware that our gutless politicians will cave in at the drop of a hat - terrified of being called racist. Therefore, I sympathise with the Israelis. At least they have the backbone to stand up for their freedoms. Quote:
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05-12.-2005, 06:38 AM
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#57 | ||||
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Community Team
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: at the bar
Posts: 12,649
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
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...and you're free to express the views that you have Carrera. Your views are endorsed and supported by many people. Quote:
I acknowledge that the Holocaust was wrong and I accept that something had to be done to protect the Jewish people. However, this is where you and I part : the creation of Israel and more importantly the displacement of 1m people was not the ethical or just solution in my opinion. If the Jewish people needed to go on the offensive, it was against the Nazi regime, if anyone. Quote:
I don't wish to be pedantic - but Israel did not exist pre-1948. The only reason a dispute arose was because the Jewish people forcibly removed the Palestinians from the territory called the statelet of israel. Quote:
Israel won the 1967 and 1973 wars. They're now locked in to a guerilla war - which brings us back to the original issue. The outcome to the guerilla war is undetermined as of now.
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.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets" - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it - Armstrong 2005 TDF morelike hypocrisy. |
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05-12.-2005, 06:46 AM
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#58 | |||
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,534
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
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The fact that you are trying to be clever comparing the Falkands invasion of 1980 to the Palestinian diaspora of 1948 illustrates that you really don't have any understanding or care about the problem at hand. Justifying holocaust with holocaust demonstrates that you lack any kind of moral compass. Quote:
Don takes the piss both ways.  Quote:
That particular bunch is a vanishingly small proportion of the total. Sure, they're wrong and they need dealing with along with all the other militant fucktards, including Zionists and the self-serving power-crazed nastinesses like Blair and Bush. Same goes for you for that matter, you are no better. |
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06-12.-2005, 01:19 AM
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#59 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Staffordshire
Posts: 4,816
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
Lim, my views are essentially a minority in this country. You'll never see my face in a BBC question time audience although you may well see Melanie Phillips from time to time.
As I said before, I'm not an expert on Israel a dn probably know more about Chechnya and the Caspian region than the Middle East. But I have read enough scribings by Max Hastings and Melanie Phillips to know Israel has a certain valid basis for its claim on the disputed territories. As MP pointed out, Palestine was originally created by the Romans at a time when the Romans had been struggling to control Jewish religious fervour and uprisings. Later invasions by Arabs also displaced Jewish people. But my point about the hollocaust is simple. If you were yourself Jewish and had relatives who had maybe fled Russia due to pogroms under the Tsars, or fled Poland, France or Germany, you would be none too keen on events that have been taking place in France and Denmark. You would be counting yourself lucky there is a state called Israel where you can take refuge. Not only that but it's a stronger state than people imagine. They probably have a far better trained army than the U.S. in relation to size. Again, the simple fact is we disagree but academics as a whole have been disagreeing over the disputed lands for decades. As I said before, the truth is there is no real absolute right or wrong. I agree with you the Palestinians obviously do have rights if you look at the situation in a certain way but they are not the only displaced peoples on the globe - as a result of some war. When the academics and historians fail to agree, disputed land claims are usually solved by war (seemingly China plans to do this). Israel won its conflict against far greater odds and, in my book, this is now the deciding factor. I suppose it also works to their advantage that a wave of evangelical fervour is sweeping through the U.S. (ask dave MC) and so many American tourists see Israel as being a kind of Christian Holy Land they have no wish to lose to Islam. Sure, religion is complicated stuff and I'm glad I'm secular. Quote:
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06-12.-2005, 01:25 AM
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#60 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Staffordshire
Posts: 4,816
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Re: Will Israel Strike First?
"Don takes the piss both ways."
He plays a shrewd game of poker and has no enemies. His is the voice of calm, moderation and balance. Fred used to get away with a lot more but lately he's been rumbled as he made the mistake of insulting other forum members instead of just me.  Myself, I'm very impulsive so if I'm having a bad day you'll probably get a rant. On my good days I'm more inclined to reason. Today I'm in a bad mood, though, because of being p****d around over my boat. Quote:
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