What now Vino????

milker

On the topic of dumb questions - I have one. The vibe I'm getting from reports on the stage is that Lance has a huge advantage because Discovery Channel Team is so good at pacing him and blocking the wind for him right up until the final few km's. From what I saw of the stage, all the other top riders got exactly the same advantage that Lance did, in that they could sit tucked in behind the Discovery Channel riders and get the same pacing/ wind blocking that Lance did.

It then becomes a case of who is better in the last few kms, and it regularly seems to be Armstrong. So is there an advantage to Armstrong due to the strength of his team or not?

Put another way, if T-Mobile were clearly the stronger team and they were pacing Ullrich - wouldn't Armstrong just sit behind them most of the way up the hills and blow them away at the end like he did today?

alibat

I like Vino, he's a bloody good rider and was greatly missed last year. He's not afraid to attack and I am sorry he had such a bad day yesterday. I hope he can get back to his old self. The other thing about him that I respect is that he tends to race for the whole season, not just a few weeks in the summer unlike someone I could mention. I am sure we have not heard the last of him.

tinks

Is anyone watching stage 11?

Vino is making a move, he's currently in a breakaway on the first climb. Interestingly, the disco boys aren't chasing him down. They think the can reel him in later or is he no longer considered a threat?

cheapie

ahahahaha!


sorry if it makes me less of a cycling fan than you are but i don't give a rat's a$$ who won the Kazahkstan national title.

limerickman

Vino & Botero were over the Madelaine ahead of the peloton : DC are chasing hard.

Lonnie Utah

Congrats to Vino. What a ride today. I guess he wanted to show everyone he still has a bit of pride. Who thinks he's now focused on riding for red polka dots?

L

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Powerful Pete

He would still have a heck of a ways to go for the polka dot jersey. I do not think that someone like Rasmussen will let him escape again (even if he has it in him after a full day breakaway).

Off Eurosport again:

KING OF THE MOUNTAIN STANDINGS AFTER THE GALIBIER:
1. Michael Rasmussen (Rabobank) 160 points
2. Christophe Moreau (Credit Agricole) 89 points
3. Santiago Botero (Phonak) 88 points
4. Alexandre Vinokourov 71 points

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PAOLO BETTINI CAMPIONE DEL MONDO x 2!

rejobako

I think his goal today was a stage win, to alleviate the red welts on his behind from the spanking he took yesterday. Perhaps in the back of his mind he was hoping he could gain back enough time to catapult him back into the GC race, but he'll need two or three more breakaways like today to get close. At this point, I think even if Armstrong were to crash and abandon, there are too many good riders between Vino and the yellow jersey for him to get back into it. He was given some leeway today (maybe more than intended, in that I'm sure some people were content to underestimate him after yesterday), but I suspect Vino will be kept much closer in check in the Pyrenees by everyone.

In the meantime, there is the further complicating factor that as far as we know, he's still supposed to be riding for Jan, who can't seem to find the proper moment to muster an attack. The three T-Mobile heavyweights need to try to find a way to conspire with the other teams to lean on Discovery, which, after today and yesterday, appear to be as formidable as was reported prior to the Tour.

One last thought: tomorrow's stage features some of the less formidable cat 2 climbs, the kind of gradient that put Discovery into trouble last Saturday because many of the riders could power through it almost as a sprint. If I were CSC or T-Mobile (or Rabobank, for that matter), I wouldn't waste an opportunity to see if Disco's mountain goats could be put into some difficulty again on these less steep climbs. I think it's safe to say they have no trouble dictating pace on a 7% gradient, but when it's more like 4.5% . . . jury's still out.

Michaelz

Not a dumb question... at least I hope not because I asked it once. It isn't just the drafting that they're there for:

If Lance gets a mechanical problem they can switch bikes, push him off to get him started, pace him back, etc. A rider with no teammates in the front climbing group has to get back to the group on his own.

They can haul water up to Lance. Other riders have to drop back, get their own water, then grind back up to the front.

Other riders do not get the same pacing advantage that Lance gets because Lance can set the pace. Not every rider is going to have the same preferred pace. Let's say that Jan's most efficient pace is faster than Lance's up gentler slopes, but less than Lance's on the steepest slopes due to his power output. (Jan at his best might have slightly better power output than Lance, but since Lance is lighter, Lance's power-weight ratio is better.) If Disco is setting the pace then they can keep it slower on gentle slopes and then put the hammer down on the steepest sections to make Jan waste energy.

Michael

rule62

In all fairness to Vino...can you imagine what he would be like with the team support that Discovery has been giving Armstrong? Kind of scary is what comes to mind for me.

cheapie

very nice explaination. i was wondering as well.

Tonto

There's a lot of truth in what you say. Discovery's dominance can only take LA so far and then it's up to him. Yesterday he proved that he's simply stronger again this year than his main rivals (so far anyway).
The advantage of having your own team set the pace comes from the fact that they set the pace the LA wants. The real damage yesterday was done when Popovych put in that ferocious final spurt. He did it on LA's instruction, so LA was ready to move up a gear. Others were taken by surprise and when you start losing touch on a climb like that it's very hard reverse the process.

The other advantage is, I think, largely a psychological one. LA is surrounded by friendly faces and there has to be some benefit from being surrounded by your buddies while your rivals face a long and lonely slog uphill.
Add to that the fact that LA knows that his teammates are watching his rivals and will cover any surprise attacks for him. So he can concentrate on his own rythm and not worry about any sudden accelerations from the guys in front, whereas his teammates don't know when the next spurt is going to come.
I sometimes think that the other teams need to get in among the 'blue train'
and break them up a bit. Get some bodies around LA and make him a little less comfortable even just to put a few more doubts in their collective mind. I think the other teams can be a bit too passive once Discovery/USPS hit the front, but then again, as with yesterday's stage, it seems it was more a case of not having the legs rather than not having the will. It's a pity, for example, that CSC didn't try something today seeing as Ullrich was never going to spoil things for Vino by attacking himself.

limerickman

I wouldn't underestimate the difficulty of tomorrows stage (stage 12).
It is a difficulty stage : plenty of categorised climbs.

Remember the Tour had a very fast first week and has just completed a tough
mountain stage (stage 10) and a killer of a stage today (11).
Todays stage was very very tough : the Madaleine followed by the Telegragh
and then the Galibier is a killer of a stage.

I think Stage 12 is an opportunity for Iles Balears and maybe Jan Ullrich.
The climbs are not as steep and you don't need to be a pure climber to get away.
CSC might also fancy their chances.

DC will try to put a cap on activity.

limerickman

I think the peloton tried the "get among the DC crew today".
The climb of the Galibier, I noticed Landis, Valverde and Basso eyeballing DC.
Landis deliberately inserted himself slap bang in there.
Armstrong could sense these guys : he kept looking around him.

Ullrich backed off and did the usual cycling out to the side and not getting involved.