EU Constitution

davidmc

Apparently you've never heard of The U.K. It doesn't suprise me. They are also potential candidates for the E.U., non

__________________
I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death.
George Carlin
US comedian and actor (1937 - )

limerickman

I have been following the debate quite closely.
The French people who are willing to vote "oui" appear to be doing so because they think that they will earn more money by making their economy more liberal.
The "non" vote want to retain their more social economy.

I worked with some German collegues, years ago, and they were made redundant by their parent company.
For the first six months on social security, they get 3/4's of their finishing salary.
If you're made redundant here, you get €150.00 (£100.00 stg) a week.
So we are in Europe, but we don't have the fully social economic model in this country.

I would like to see the "non" vote win - but I want to see the full social economy applied throughout Europe and not just Germany/france/Spain/italy.

darkboong

AFAIK on the UK Mainland the rate is £55 stg/week and it's means tested. Further : Any work you do (paid or unpaid) is subtracted from that.

limerickman

It's the same here : any money earned is deducted for welfare.
There is no state help for mortgage repayments/utility bills (subject to means test).

A mate of mine went from earning €50k per year to the dole (made redundant, with no redundancy).
Banks were practically terrorising him over the mortgage and his repayments.

MountainPro

no probs....i would love to visit Chile one day..

darkboong

Yeah, of course I am. I am just as concerned about the politicos in Downing Street who insist on lying to us to justify removing our civil liberties.



Which is precisely why I am an Anarchist.

StartledPancake

It would suprise me greatly that Id never heard of the UK, considering I was born there...

The countries of the UK as the name suggests are united, voting as one. Ireland, (not Nothern Ireland, thats part of the UK) is a seperate country.

I would start a tirade against the teaching of geography in schools these days but considering I cant even spell Chile, Ill just shut up.

I had a very interesting talk with a friend of mine who specialises in European law. She's one of the few people I know whose actually read the document and is definatly the only person I know who understands it! Her take on it is its NOT a constitution as laymen (me) would understand it. Its complexity is due to the vast amount of current European law in place already which it has to take into account making simplicity impossible. Its also written to be unabiguous as possible.

She's pretty and charming so Ive changed my vote to a resounding "Yes".

Shouldnt this be a poll Mr Limmerick?

StartledPancake

I wonder how many times I would have got that wrong if you hadnt put me out of my spelling misery... Its hot and crate of beer is about 5 UK pounds here in Holland. How can anyone be expected to operate with any lucidity under such circumstances?

MountainPro

its mostly an American thing, kids here are taught world geography from a young age and are very well versed.



The document is being critisised all over at the moment because no one understands what it means or what will truly happen when (if) it is implemented.

MountainPro

a fiver...?

thats cheap.

i was at a barbeque last weekend that cost £25 per person to get into and the tea/coffee was £4.50 per cup and the beer was £8.00 per pint!!...i thought i was in Dublin for a moment...

StartledPancake

You have to take the bottles back to get it at that rate, but when you take the bottles back your bike racks empty, so... Its a viscous circle you see.

In Holland the local council regulates the price of beer at concerts so if you go to a festival beer is cheaper than at a bar. Yeah, people in the UK have a lot to fear from a more continental lifestyle...

£4.50 for a cup of coffee??? I hope it was for charity mate...

davidmc

Heard a discussion at the Brookings Institution that one of the English participants noted that he was dismayed by Condi Rice's recent remarks endorsing the E.U. because it would pit one Union-the E.U.-against the United States. It would marginalize your countries foreign policy objectives by making the union speak as a whole. It may be good economically but it would not be a democratic system is what the british speaker contended .

__________________
I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death.
George Carlin
US comedian and actor (1937 - )

StartledPancake

The majority of residents of the UK have more sympathy with French and German foreign policy than with their own goverments (67% being against the Iraq war). I doubt this is a problem. As you say, its just the opinion of one man and hes probably one of those nutty conservative/UKIP guys, nobody listens to them any more.

The EU constitution can be changed if they recieve a million votes to do so, that British speaker was appalingly misinformed so anything he says should be disregarded.

Carrera

It looks like the French may well ground the constitution last I heard. Personally I don't blame the French. It really isn't right that some remote bureaucrat in Brussels should be able to overturn national policy at the drop of a hat (one example being Greece's fishing policy).
What the French are saying loud and clear is they don't want weak trade unions, long working hours, cheap labour and poor social security protection. It's a case of either living like human beings or selling yourself to the principles of capitalism and exploitation as we witness in China where people work for a pittance to feed guzzling companies.
The whole Thatcher philosophy terrifies the French - exploited workers who don't dare bark at an employer and who have little protection from capitalist concerns. What we need is a decent standard of living for the working person built on the Frech model of high welfare, personal space and state protection.