Times Climbing l'Alpe d'huez

sopas

Times Climbing l'Alpe d'huez

38:37 – Ulrich 2004 (ITT)
37:36 – Armstrong 2004 (ITT)
39:06 - Mayo 2003
38:01 - Armstrong 2001
39:02 - Virenque 1997
38:23 - Ullrich 1997
37:35 - Pantani 1997 (current record)
39:30 - Riis 1995
39:28 - Indurain/Zulle 1995
38:04 - Pantani 1995
38:00 - Pantani 1994
39:45 - Indurain, 1991
41:50 - Fignon 1989
48:00 - Hinault/Lemond 1986
45:22 - Coppi 1952

It is interesting to note that Ulrich climbed faster on a road stage in 1997 when he won the TdF than this year 2004 in the ITT. He was certainly in better shape back then.

babylou

It is tough to compare times, in detail, from year to year since atmospheric conditions can affect times.

Is the time correct for Lemond/Hinault? If so, then WTF? EPO or no the gap to today is huge.

sopas

Yes the time for Lemond/Hinault is correct; 48 minutes. However we must take into consideration that they began the climb alone with too much time over the other riders and climbed at a "very slow pace" also Hinault knee was hurting him and told Lemmond to take it easy. At the end both arrived on top shacking hands. Still, if I am not mistaken, the 45 minute barrier had not yet been beaten by then. Coppi's record was there unbeaten for more than 30 years!!! From 1990 and on, riders began doing it in less than 40 minutes.

You are also right atmospheric conditions can affect times, however I think my comparison of Ullrich 97 and Ullrich 2004 is relevant enough since it was a sunny day with no wind at all on those both occasions. Am I right?

Roadrash Dunc

He is only 13 second slower and by the same standarads , Lance was only 25 seconds quicker.So net net , a 38 second swing.
I wouldnt say thats an obvious loss of form for that climb over the years.

art703

Fausto Coppi, thats the one that impresses me. That time was posted on a single speed on dirt roads, still faster than people ride it today.

sopas

Well actually I don't think that the 13 second difference of Ulrich in 97 compared wity 2004 represents an abvious loss or form. But what I do think that shows an obvious loss of form is the fact that in 2004 the stage was a short ITT were riders give their 100% from the start, besides having a different bike, helmet etc. However in 1997 the climb to L'Alpe d'huez was part of a long stage and before they started climbing the riders had already done more than 100 kilometers. So I think it is very relevant to see how Ullrich climbed faster in 97 on a long stage than in 2004 on a ITT. In 2004, Ullrich was certainly far from the shape shown in 97.

sopas

Yes, and with a much heavier bike than those used today. I wonder what would be his time today with a modern bike and different trainning.

ed073

I'd love to have seen Theunisse have a real crack when on top form.....and Claveroylat.

Roadrash Dunc

sopas you missed my point.

By the same criteria , Lance was only 25 seconds faster in the ITT than when he road it a few years earlier at the end of a long stage.
See what i am saying? Its quite a small difference.

But you are right , Ulrich isnt the rider he was in 1997.But i think thats as much mental as it is physical.

sopas

I agree with you that many factors must be taken into consideration when comparing times over different years. Specially if they attacked at the beginning of the climb or later since we all assume they go at 100% in the ITT. Armstrong climbing in 2001 was absolutely incredible, did he attack from the bottom? I don't remember, and what about Ulrich in 97? did the German attack from the bottom?

I think this is very important. Just look at Indurain/Zulle time in 1995 (time 39:28). Indurain did not chase Pantani from the bottom but only later on the climb, but once he put pressure the gap with Pantani did no increase anymore (in fact it was reduced from 1:30 to 1:24!!). So I think it is fair to say that if Indurain had not let Pantani go at first his time would have been better.

meehs

That is amazing! Wow!

ilpirata

I must agree with you Sopas, that Ullrich is not in quite the form he showed in 97. The individual time trial should certainly allow for better climb times compared to a full stage, all else equal. I also agree that with Meeh about the impressiveness of Fausto Coppi's climb. Pantani's record will certainly be broken in the coming years, but I would hope not as a result of an individual time trial, as it seems that would not be fair.

Roadrash Dunc

Comments from race organisers and riders alike , i dont think you'll see another ITT on the Alpe for quite some time.

Powerful Pete

Noted that Kaiser Jan did not have a particularly briliant tour, or time trial this year. But could the fact that it was a 'ready, set, go' kind of ride affected a 'diesel' type rider like Ullrich?

Just a thought...

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