Spoiler - If yesterday didn't do it....

flintman

Of course, if what Filippo Simeoni said about the good Doctor is in fact true, then it's a whole new ballgame. NONE of us know the truth.

I'm a fan of LA, he has done wonders for cycling interest in the USA, but it did seem a bit personal, and uncalled for to me.

Most of us respect folks that stand up for what is right against the masses. I don't know that this is what Simeoni represents, but in the end, it very well could be the case? None of us know, the jury is still out.

jhuskey

We all run on emotion some times. Look at Voeckler, do you think her held onto the yellow jersey one more day without it and he is a hero.Arrogant! It is all in perception. Some of the people who post here can be perceived to be arrogant. Limerickman is opionated(no offence Lim I have respect for you) Memphman ( what a character ,wherever he is) and several other others I have semi grown to know in the last year or so including myself I can be a Sh**head if provoked but we all get over it. We are here posting because we love the sport but unfortunately suck too much to be in the tour and in my case too old also. You cannot compete on a higher level without passion and sometimes it overuns the rational. It is easy to sit on the couch and say I am above that crap. So don't criticize a man until you have sprinted a mile in his shoe.
That way you are a mile aheads of the hack and you have his freakin shoes. Finish his sorry A** off. l almost got serious for a moment but came back to reality.

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Whenever I can't get excited about riding I just fantasize about someone else's bike.

ItalianStallion

I would. But in right place, at right time.

I am glad to see that most people here understand the point of my initial message. I am not doubting Lance the athlete, I respect him for what he's done, but sometimes he lacks either in personal, or, as in this case, leadership qualities.

He used the Tour (and hence the sponsors, organizer, and most importantly, the fans) to make a personal point. And the fact that he won 5 tours, came back from cancer, etc, has nothing to do with it. He - I am about to use a big word, forgive me, I cannot think of another - "abused" his position of power. I don't care whether Merckx did it, or in fact anyone else. If it ain't right, you're not supposed to do it.

It was unsportsmanlike behavior today from Lance. He said he did for the good of the group. But all he wanted to do was block a possible win for Simeoni. And I think the group could have managed quite well on that front.......

Finally, one last point. If I am not mistaken, Simeoni was in the breakaway yesterday. Why did nobody go after him then? They could have brought him back in no time..... If the peloton really hates Simeoni, he wouldn't be allowed even space to piss on the side of the road.

I my opinion, it was personal between Simeoni and Lance. And Armstrong did not deal with it the best way he could.

flintman

I'm not condemning LA as such, I just don't see it as something he should have done. Whom amongst us is to say that what Simeoni has said about the good Doctor is factual or not? None of us. The guy has NO chance to do any damage to any classification whatsoever. It just seems a bit trite to me, sort of like grandstanding.

davidbod

They didn't go after him in the break yesterday because they weren't planning on the break surviving in the end. Today they had no intentions of running down the break, thus the winner was going to come from the break. This was a very deliberate visible move by LA. I doubt he cares a whole lot what you think because of it.

flintman

Does the Peloton ever "plan" on a breakaway lasting to the end? They weigh whom is in the breakaway, and what impact said breakaway might have on whatever classification, and then "decide" what to do. It was certainly personal, no other way to dice it up.

Emerald

Simeoni has dissed Lance in public. Whether it was direct or indirectly through his comments on the doctor is irrelevant.

To me, Lance made a point that under no circumstances was Simeoni winning the stage,or any other stage for that matter, today.

Yesterday was different. Lance and the rest of the Postals had a plan and that plan was that they were going to win the last big Alpine stage, no matter who broke away.

I applaud Lance for doing what he did today.
It was interesting that Simeoni sat at the rear of the peloton after the confrontation, like the jealous poiled brat that he is! Only a few of the riders were willing to give Simeoni the time of day.

Lance on the other hand was smiling and chatting away to most of his main rivals - which to me, indicates that the majority of the peloton are on his side.

Andy Grow

OK, so the french and yur-a-peein' press don't like it. Big deal. They don't like him anyways.

I saw it like this - the BIG DOG putting the little dog in his place, you know like in a pack of dogs. Simoni is/was the bad dog, and the dominant one put him in his place.

Nothing more, nothing less.

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Andy Grow
Kodiak, Alaska

mojomarc

But this is nothing new in the sport, or even with Lance. Look at how he responded back a few years ago after he arguably gifted the stage win to Pantani and Pantani responded by saying that it was no gift. Personally, I find this tremendous drive that LA has to personally destroy his competition one of the more compelling aspects of his personality, but I can understand how it would rub people the wrong way. To me, his is kind of the cycling equivalent of Michael Jordan, who always went out of his way to crush anyone who ever publically doubted him or showed him up.

Also, remember back last week, when Simeoni tried to break again and was caught in the last meters? Simeoni said his break wasn't for any tactical reasons, but "a matter of pride" to win the stage as a revenge for how he feels he has been treated in the doping scandal, so complaining about Armstrong without equally condemning Simeoni for his actions (which were clearly legit) isn't very even-handed.


I don't think you quite know the whole story with Simeoni here. First, you've asserted that there was a personal issue between the two, but it's actually a public issue, as Simeoni testified that Ferrari was encouraging doping--the public nature of these charges has done nothing to help the image of cycling. When LA stated publically that he didn't think the event in question ever happened and Simeoni was lying about his charges that Ferrari taught him how to use EPO without being caught (and thus backhandedly implying that's exactly what Armstrong was doing, since LA has admitted that he had worked with Ferrari in the past), not only did Simeoni fight with him in the press about it, but he actually filed anti-defamation charges against LA. The guy was suing the leader of the Tour, and then trying to use the Tour as a stage to win and thus gain fame, and LA basically wasn't going to let that happen on his Tour. You don't let a guy win who will then give more publicity to the doping scandal that is really harming cycling if you're LA. I can't blame him in the least.


They knew he couldn't last, so they simply allowed him to go for a while and then mowed him down like they mowed down the rest of the field. On a flatter stage, Simeoni had a better chance of getting away, which is why the different tactic was used.

antoineg

What I found most interesting was the conjunction of the fact that Armstrong's gripe with Simoni stems from comments made about the doctor who supposedly gave doping advice, and Armstrong's later comment that he did what he did "to protect the peloton".

Let's play devil's advocate. If the peleton were clean, wouldn't they want a doctor who was trying to advocate drug use within the sport run out of town on a rail?

Conversely, if the peleton were generally dirty, wouldn't they want to shut up someone was was raising a minor stink about a doctor who was providing drugs?

I use Occam's razor to theorize that Armstrong is doping and Armstrong doesn't like that Simoni is trying to expose a doctor that Armstrong has used in the past. It's the simplest explanation, given the circumstances and the oblique comments.

Brunswick_kate

Yeah, it's a simple explanation, that's for sure. Handy for all those people who are allergic to reasoned thinking.

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antoineg

Even the most casual reader of this forum knows that you are allergic to any suggestion of doping by any cyclist. So your comments mean very little.

jhuskey

[QUOTE=antoineg]What I found most interesting was the conjunction of the fact that Armstrong's gripe with Simoni stems from comments made about the doctor who supposedly gave doping advice, and Armstrong's later comment that he did what he did "to protect the peloton".


WHEN DID SIMONI GET INVOLVED IN THIS? IM LOST. I USE A SADDLE HE HELPED DESIGN.

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Whenever I can't get excited about riding I just fantasize about someone else's bike.

flintman

I don't think any of us here know the whole story. Simeoni testified that the Doctor encouraged him (Simeoni) to use dope. How does LA know what happened between these two men? He doesn't. My point is that Simeoni could very well be telling the truth, none of us know. As far as Siomeoni's testimony "harming" cycling--well, IF he is telling the truth, then cycling had it coming anyway. Someone is not telling the truth in this case, that much is clear. Why do people automatically "assume" the guy leading the TDF is the truthful one? I don't know which one is lying, I hope it comes out which ever way it goes. Again, none of us know the facts.

And doesn't Ferrari have a, ummm--reputation?