One Cyclist Killed; Another Seriously Injured

xkred27

http://www.pressdemocrat.com/local/...cyclist_b1.html

A beautiful Easter morning in the Sonoma Valley turns into this. I live
just a couple of miles from the scene of the crime, and avoid that stretch
of road like the plague--not that even a 20-foot shoulder would have saved
these two from this guy (Note quote: "He had not realized that he struck the
bicyclists")

Take care out there.

--
Peter

Anti-spam =
a) Remove NS_
b) Replace 3 zeroes with alpha O's

psycholist

"xkred27" <NS_v0ny0rk@s0nic.net> wrote in message
newswzec.5204$Fo4.62326@typhoon.sonic.net...
> http://www.pressdemocrat.com/local/...cyclist_b1.html
>
> A beautiful Easter morning in the Sonoma Valley turns into this. I live
> just a couple of miles from the scene of the crime, and avoid that stretch
> of road like the plague--not that even a 20-foot shoulder would have saved
> these two from this guy (Note quote: "He had not realized that he struck
the
> bicyclists")
>
> Take care out there.
>
> --
> Peter
>
> Anti-spam =
> a) Remove NS_
> b) Replace 3 zeroes with alpha O's
>

They released this murderer on $30,000 bond!!!!! Unbelieveable.
Very sad on so many fronts.

Bob C.

Paul

In a just world, the driver would surrender all his assets to the families
of the victems and would then be executed.

> > A beautiful Easter morning in the Sonoma Valley turns into this. I live
> > just a couple of miles from the scene of the crime, and avoid that
stretch
> > of road like the plague--not that even a 20-foot shoulder would have
saved
> > these two from this guy (Note quote: "He had not realized that he struck
> the
> > bicyclists")
> >

David Kerber

In article <c5ejip$e6f7$1@news3.infoave.net>, technico@wctel.net says...
>
> "xkred27" <NS_v0ny0rk@s0nic.net> wrote in message
> newswzec.5204$Fo4.62326@typhoon.sonic.net...
> > http://www.pressdemocrat.com/local/...cyclist_b1.html
> >
> > A beautiful Easter morning in the Sonoma Valley turns into this. I live
> > just a couple of miles from the scene of the crime, and avoid that stretch
> > of road like the plague--not that even a 20-foot shoulder would have saved
> > these two from this guy (Note quote: "He had not realized that he struck
> the
> > bicyclists")
> >
> > Take care out there.
> >
> > --
> > Peter
> >
> > Anti-spam =
> > a) Remove NS_
> > b) Replace 3 zeroes with alpha O's
> >
>
> They released this murderer on $30,000 bond!!!!! Unbelieveable.
> Very sad on so many fronts.

In most states, the bond has nothing to do with the severity of the
crime; it's based solely on the likelyhood that the person will run and
not show up for their next legal proceeding, and maybe on the
probability that they might commit another crime in the interim.

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in the
newsgroups if possible).

Brendon M. Troy

"Paul" <Paul@myplace.com> wrote
> In a just world, the driver would surrender all his assets to the
families
> of the victems and would then be executed.

Oh yes, that would make the situation *better*.

-Brendon

tk

> > In a just world, the driver would surrender all his assets to the
> families
> > of the victems and would then be executed.
>
> Oh yes, that would make the situation *better*.
> -Brendon

The driver would never do it again...

May brother Alan be in heaven an hour, before the devil knows he is dead.

Mike Jacoubowsky/Chain Reaction Bicycles

> Apparently, the driver did not know he had hit the cyclists and continued
> west for about 700 feet until he was stopped by an off-duty Vallejo police
> officer, the spokeswoman said. The officer detained the man until CHP
> officers arrived, she said. He is now in custody and charged with driving
> under the influence.

I read and hear about things like this and once in a while think that maybe
I shouldn't be taking life for granted. I don't think there's anything I
can take from what happened that might make me safer on the road, nor much I
can see that might be done to ensure that things like this don't happen in
general. The guy was drunk, before noon even. Unless we make alcoholism a
capital offense...

When I was in DC for the Bicycle Summit, we were discussing how best to use
money to make the roads safer for cycling. When we looked at how money is
spent and where most of the danger comes from, it was blindingly clear that
ANYTHING done to reduce drinking drivers being on the road had the most
significant impact on safety. Nothing else was even close. I'm just not
sure how far society is willing to go to handle the problem. Look at all
the hoopla every time they set up sobriety checkpoints! Still, this guy was
operating far outside of the norm, meaning that any additional efforts to
target drunk drivers on the road is best spent when there are more drunk
drivers on the road, specifically in the evenings.

Basic laws regarding serving alcohol in California can be found here-
http://www.bartendergirl.com/gar_state.htm

So I question this- is there a need to be selling alcohol at 6am at a bar
(or anywhere else?)? So I retract my earlier statement that there's nothing
that can be done about accidents like this. I don't know if the guy was
actually drinking in a bar or had a six-pack at home before he took to the
road, but it seems that anything done to encourage early recreational
drinking is a bad thing.

This particular story, these particular cyclists aren't merely an excuse for
an academic exercise. They were both customers of ours.

--Mike--
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com

Q.

"Brendon M. Troy" <btroy@admissions.spamguard.rochester.edu> wrote in
message news:c5el0l$c8j$1@mail1.ats.rochester.edu...
> "Paul" <Paul@myplace.com> wrote
> > In a just world, the driver would surrender all his assets to the
> families
> > of the victems and would then be executed.
>
> Oh yes, that would make the situation *better*.

Yes ... yes it would. Especially if the victim had young children. It
could make the difference between the children living in poverty, or going
to college.

C.Q.C.

David Kerber

In article <tBCec.21848$Xc.21736@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com>,
MikeJ@ChainReaction.com says...
> > Apparently, the driver did not know he had hit the cyclists and continued
> > west for about 700 feet until he was stopped by an off-duty Vallejo police
> > officer, the spokeswoman said. The officer detained the man until CHP
> > officers arrived, she said. He is now in custody and charged with driving
> > under the influence.
>
> I read and hear about things like this and once in a while think that maybe
> I shouldn't be taking life for granted. I don't think there's anything I
> can take from what happened that might make me safer on the road, nor much I
> can see that might be done to ensure that things like this don't happen in
> general. The guy was drunk, before noon even. Unless we make alcoholism a
> capital offense...

Alcoholism isn't, but in some countries, drunk driving is...

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in the
newsgroups if possible).

Rick Warner

"xkred27" <NS_v0ny0rk@s0nic.net> wrote in message news:<Dwzec.5204$Fo4.62326@typhoon.sonic.net>...
> http://www.pressdemocrat.com/local/...cyclist_b1.html
>
> A beautiful Easter morning in the Sonoma Valley turns into this. I live
> just a couple of miles from the scene of the crime, and avoid that stretch
> of road like the plague--not that even a 20-foot shoulder would have saved
> these two from this guy (Note quote: "He had not realized that he struck the
> bicyclists")
>
> Take care out there.

Problem is, that is not an easy area for non-locals to navigate except on
Hwy 12. I would suspect that they were out visiting the wineries on
12, anyway, hence the draw to stay along the highway. The only alternative
to get anywhere would be to navigate the roads between 12 and Annadel SP,
and those are a maze and do not show up well on most of the maps that one can
find easily. A bit of a shake-up for me. On Saturday I had given a friend
directions from where I live (Mountain View, same as the deceased victim) to
Santa Rosa, and I had directed them to follow 121 then 12 from Napa over to
SR. Now I need to re-think.

- rick

xkred27

"Rick Warner" <rickwarner@earthlink.net> wrote
>
>On Saturday I had given a friend
> directions from where I live (Mountain View, same as the deceased victim)
to
> Santa Rosa, and I had directed them to follow 121 then 12 from Napa over
to
> SR. Now I need to re-think.
>
12 is such a mixed bag in terms of shoulder width. I had to go into Santa
Rosa today and drove by the spot where this occurred. A roadside bouquet
and pink paint in the road were the only evidence of the prior day's
carnage. The incident occurred on a stretch of road heavily shaded by
valley oaks and with a 2-3 foot shoulder. The big oaks rain litter on the
shoulder and on the road, further increasing the danger. The victims were
less than a few hundred yards from a point where 12 opens up wide--you
emerge from deep shade and the shoulder widens to 8-10 feet--and stays that
way for the next several miles all the way into Santa Rosa. Going in the
opposite direction--toward Napa--the shoulder disappears outright--in Glen
Ellen, near Trinity Road. 12 used to be a true 2-lane "country" road. With
population growth and, in particular, the suburbanization of Sonoma County,
the road has turned into a commute corridor with wall-to-wall traffic going
50-60 mph most times of the day. But as has been noted, these are all side
issues: The man was blind drunk before noon. Mere sobriety would have
pretty much mitigated all risk factors.

--
Peter

Anti-spam =
a) Remove NS_
b) Replace 3 zeroes with alpha O's

Michael J. Klein

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 13:52:20 -0400, "Brendon M. Troy"
<btroy@admissions.spamguard.rochester.edu> wrote:

>"Paul" <Paul@myplace.com> wrote
>> In a just world, the driver would surrender all his assets to the
>families
>> of the victems and would then be executed.
>
>Oh yes, that would make the situation *better*.
>
>-Brendon

Yes Brendon - it would. If people were actually forced to bear the
responsibility of their actions up to - and including forfeiture of
their life - social behavior would change. It would make it *better*
for the next law-abiding Citizen who comes along. As long as society
panders to criminals, stating solutions such as "education" (the PC
catch-all patch for everything), nothing will change - why would it?
Where is the motivation? Where was the motivation for this criminal
to _not_ drink and drive when he knew fucking well that he could get
away with it?

Doesn't matter whether or not we like it - this is life.

If you wanna kill someone - just spill vodka all over your shirt,
drink some and then park your car at an intersection you know this
person will eventually cross. Then just run them over (while leaving
the bottle on the front seat) - presto! OTOH, shoot a rapist while
attacking your wife in your own home (well, in Amerika anyway) and see
what happens to you!

The reasons that solutions such as the one proposed above do not work
is because they have never been fully implemented. Less than 3% of
the prisoners sentenced to death are actually executed. Before one
can say that the death sentence doesn't work, the death sentence
should be implemented 100%.

I apologize for being so far off-topic. If it helps, in my vodka/car
scenario above, I suppose one could have a bike rack on the vehicle.

Michael J. Klein
Please replace asiancastings for mousepotato

S. Anderson

"Michael J. Klein" <usenet@mousepotato.com> wrote in message
newsklm70hg79r90233n1i0as47thh4h7vqfk@4ax.com...
> the bottle on the front seat) - presto! OTOH, shoot a rapist while
> attacking your wife in your own home (well, in Amerika anyway) and see
> what happens to you!

I seem to recall a case in Texas where a young man knocked on the door of a
house to get directions to a Halloween party and was summarily executed by
the homeowner. He escaped punishment entirely.

> The reasons that solutions such as the one proposed above do not work
> is because they have never been fully implemented. Less than 3% of
> the prisoners sentenced to death are actually executed. Before one
> can say that the death sentence doesn't work, the death sentence
> should be implemented 100%.

That's because it's likely that only 3% were correctly convicted and
sentenced to the death penalty! Nothing like being executed by the state by
mistake, you DO get to have your name cleared posthumously by DNA evidence.

Cheers,

Scott..

Curtis L. Russell

On Tue, 13 Apr 2004 00:30:50 -0400, "S. Anderson"
<scott.anderson3@zsympaticoz.ca> wrote:

>I seem to recall a case in Texas where a young man knocked on the door of a
>house to get directions to a Halloween party and was summarily executed by
>the homeowner. He escaped punishment entirely.

I remember it as Louisiana and the person killed was a Japanese
citizen. The legal process was monitored by the Japanese consular
people and press, the U.S. government, and various other interested
parties, so I'm guessing that they at least dotted all the Is and
crossed all the Ts.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...