cycling and hearing damage?

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Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
damage? And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
wind noise while still being alert to traffic?

thanks,
Matt

salsashark88 "at" hotmail "dot" com

> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
> damage? And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
> wind noise while still being alert to traffic?
>
> thanks,
> Matt

Matt: Is the noise while cycling really that bad? Curiously, I notice
silence more than anything. Wind noise is rarely much of an issue, even at
relatively high speeds (when descending). I'll pay a bit more attention to
this tomorrow morning. Could be I'm way-wrong, but it seems to me that
things are quieter when I'm out riding than when I'm in a car.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

I've only noticed the noise of wind when I'm wearing a helmet....

I'd be curious too..

Mike
http://mikebeauchamp.com

"Mike Jacoubowsky" <mikej1@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:O%4dc.34223$UA4.3517@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...
> > Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> > between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
> > damage? And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
> > wind noise while still being alert to traffic?
> >
> > thanks,
> > Matt
>
> Matt: Is the noise while cycling really that bad? Curiously, I notice
> silence more than anything. Wind noise is rarely much of an issue, even
at
> relatively high speeds (when descending). I'll pay a bit more attention
to
> this tomorrow morning. Could be I'm way-wrong, but it seems to me that
> things are quieter when I'm out riding than when I'm in a car.
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>
>

Matthew Thomas wrote:
> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link between
> the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing damage?
> And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce wind noise
> while still being alert to traffic?
> thanks, Matt
> salsashark88 "at" hotmail "dot" com



Dear Matt,

At typical bicycling speeds, the wind noise allows conversation with
nearby riders, admittedly punctuated by puffs and gasps.

Racers worry about being heard shifting gears as they attack and losing
the element of surprise.

The noise of the wind turbulence around Mr. Spock's pointy ears at
20-30 mph is roughly comparable to the conversation in a modestly
busy restaurant overlaid with whatever radio station strikes the
manager's fancy.

Modern noises can indeed deafen us, but our hearing is not so delicate
that the wind will deafen us.

Hearing loss is generally due to infections, age, and enormously louder
noises, such as over-amped modern music, badly muffled engines, gunfire,
and factory machinery.

Another way to look at it (one of my better mixed metaphors) is to
remember that the same noise level as the wind while you're bicycling
will lulll you to sleep if it comes from a fountain or the ocean. It's
the music that deafens surfers, not the sound of the waves.

Any simple ear plugs that shut out the wind noise directly (instead
of reducing the turbulence that causes it) would also shut out
traffic noise.

Be glad you're not a basset hound.

If you're having hearing problems, see an oto-rhyno-laryngologist, the
ENT or ear-nose-throat doctor. If the noise of the wind while you're
bicycling is bothering you, it's likely that something else is wrong.

Good luck,

Carl Fogel



--

Matthew Thomas wrote:
> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link between
> the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing damage?
> And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce wind noise
> while still being alert to traffic?
> thanks, Matt
> salsashark88 "at" hotmail "dot" com



Dear Matt,

Serendipity:

http://www.ucomics.com/calvinandhobbes/1993/04/08/

or

http://tinyurl.com/3y94x

Why are you all looking at me bug-eyed?

Carl Fogel



--

Matthew Thomas wrote:

> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
> damage?

Do you also ride motorbikes - or did a motorcyclist ask you? I was bemused
when I first saw your question, but there seem to be a few web-pages
suggesting motorcyclists might suffer hearing-loss from the wind noise.

One of them also seemed to suggest that wind noise increased exponentially
with speed (100 dB at 30mph - seemed high to me; 115 at 60mph) - which
suggests to me that most cyclists are likely to be quite safe. Maybe
someone here knows differently, though?

AC

Mike Beauchamp wrote:
> I've only noticed the noise of wind when I'm wearing a helmet....

Me too.

On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 02:14:30 -0400, Fredzep wrote:
> I have wondered this same thing myself particularly after
> being passed by one of those loud pipes clowns or a truck. My solution
> is to ride where or when there less traffic or preferably off
> road(conditions permitting).

How do you get anywhere useful? I mean, mostly, I go to places where
other people are to socialize, work, trade, or share. Most of those
places are deep within the motor vehicle infrastructure and see quite a
bit of traffic (including transit buses and other large service vehicles).

So do you just not go out where other people are or what?

Elmo.

On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 21:49:26 -0700, Matthew Thomas wrote:
> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link between
> the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing damage?

I would be suspicious of such a link. Wind noise usually just SEEMS loud.
I've never been unable to hear traffic over the wind and that implies to
me that the wind is not as loud as traffic and therefore cycling puts you
at not much more risk for hearing damage than walking on the sidewalk.
(Though I do my best to always plug my ears when passing sirens on
emergency vehicles.)

> And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce wind noise
> while still being alert to traffic?

If you want to cut down on ear turbulence and also decrease the amount of
cold air blowing into your ears (which could promote infection and other
hearing risks), get yourself a very thin ear warmer. Mine is a relatively
fine lycra knit headband that pulls down over my forehead, covers both
ears, and goes around the base of my skull. It streamlines the head to
reduce wind noise and traps the warm air around your ears.

Elmo King

Matthew Thomas wrote:

> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
> damage?

Has anyone researched if drivers of cars, let alone lorries or trucks,
are deafened permanently by the noise of their vehicles?

> And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
> wind noise while still being alert to traffic?

Compared to cyclists, passengers of cars hear virtually nothing when it
comes to 'alertness to traffic'. Maybe you are bothered personally by
wind noise, but I don't see a reason why one should really care for this.
However: A wad of cotton wool will supposedly do the trick for you.

Patrick

On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 05:00:30 GMT, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <mikej1@ix.netcom.com>
wrote:

<it seems to me that
<things are quieter when I'm out riding than when I'm in a car.

....until you turn off the Tchaikovsky ;-)

Hello Matt.

The human ear does have a certain amount of recoverability when
exposed to moderately loud noises for short periods of time.

I have a profound hearing loss in both ears, and wear a Hearing Aid in
one ear all the time. Wind noise does become aggravating, and quite
annoying, but my Hearing Aid does have a volume control. Amplifing
wind noise like this could perhaps be a detriment to us hearing aid
users, as the noise may be amplified to levels hovering at, or
slightly exceeding 100db.

If wind noise somehow bothers you, or you have concerns, and would
like to do all that is possible to protect your hearing, there are ear
plugs that are placed within the ear canal, that drop volume levels
perhaps 20-30db, are virtually unnoticeable, not all that
uncomfortable, or stupid looking, can be worn in any weather, and
permit unhindered normal conversation,etc.

Generally, gun shops, and I even think places like Wal-Mart will carry
units such as these in stock in the sporting dept. I can remember one
plug that was called "Hearos" Thier range of sophistication can cost
between a few dollars to perhaps $20-25 for a pair. Hope this helps,
Mark D.

ebigmatt888@hotmail.com (Matthew Thomas) wrote in message news:<6c99a27b.0404072049.7e0b2ef@posting.google.com>...
> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
> damage? And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
> wind noise while still being alert to traffic?
>
> thanks,
> Matt
>
> salsashark88 "at" hotmail "dot" com

On 7 Apr 2004 21:49:26 -0700, bigmatt888@hotmail.com (Matthew Thomas)
may have said:

>Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
>between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
>damage?

The noise level from that cause is so low that I seriously doubt that
anyone would ever fund such a study.

>And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
>wind noise while still being alert to traffic?

A do-rag tied so that it goes over the ears should do nicely. You
might even start a fashion trend...

Remember; the wind will never be as loud as the Harley that just went
by with straight pipes. If you want to look for a road-noise-related
hearing hazard, look at the motorized traffic, not the wind.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 07:30:25 -0400, William Holiday
<hattertown@yahoo.com> may have said:

>On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 05:00:30 GMT, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <mikej1@ix.netcom.com>
>wrote:
>
><it seems to me that
><things are quieter when I'm out riding than when I'm in a car.
>
>...until you turn off the Tchaikovsky ;-)

But why would you do that?

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 02:50:13 -0700, Elmo Spam King
<elspammo@bitmine.net> may have said:

>
>On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 02:14:30 -0400, Fredzep wrote:
>> I have wondered this same thing myself particularly after
>> being passed by one of those loud pipes clowns or a truck. My solution
>> is to ride where or when there less traffic or preferably off
>> road(conditions permitting).
>
>How do you get anywhere useful? I mean, mostly, I go to places where
>other people are to socialize, work, trade, or share. Most of those
>places are deep within the motor vehicle infrastructure and see quite a
>bit of traffic (including transit buses and other large service vehicles).
>
>So do you just not go out where other people are or what?

Not everyone lives in an urban metropolis. Some actually reside in
places where interesting activities abound within a radius easily
reached by a bike rider, often via routes that are fairly free of the
need to dodge Kenworths and Excursions. Take me, for example...in
Houston.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

>> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
>> between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
>> damage? And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to
>> reduce wind noise while still being alert to traffic?
>
> Matt: Is the noise while cycling really that bad? Curiously, I
> notice silence more than anything.

It's the kind of thing you're so used to that you don't notice it. I
usually wear a balaclava or hat over my ears during the winter months.
Wind noise is highly noticeable when I then occasionally go out with a
naked head. But during the summer, I'm totally oblivious to the noise
after the first couple of rides without hat.

There's probably no scientific evidence yet but I suspect this constant
high frequency noise could damage hearing to some extent. On busy roads,
noise from car tyres and engines is also a worry (fast roads re tyres;
inner cities re engines).

~PB

Anonymous Cowar wrote:
> Matthew Thomas wrote:
> > Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> > between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent
> > hearing damage?
> Do you also ride motorbikes - or did a motorcyclist ask you? I was
> bemused when I first saw your question, but there seem to be a few
> web-pages suggesting motorcyclists might suffer hearing-loss from the
> wind noise.
> One of them also seemed to suggest that wind noise increased
> exponentially with speed (100 dB at 30mph - seemed high to me; 115 at
> 60mph) - which suggests to me that most cyclists are likely to be quite
> safe. Maybe someone here knows differently, though?
> AC



Dear Matt and A.C.,

Street motorcycles are a different kettle of fish than bicycles because
the speeds are much higher and the exhaust noise is added. A typical
bicycle is going to roll at only about 15 to 25 mph, a sedate stroll
for a street motorcycle, and the only engine noise is the panting of
the rider.

Hearing loss from noise is the result of decibel level, or energy, but
this is not actaully a very good measure for this particular situation.

The trouble is that absolute sound energy is usually measured for sounds
at a reasonable distance--five feet away, within a room, inside a car.

This makes sense for normal sounds, but not for what we're calling wind
noise on a bicycle. There is practically no wind noise produced by a
bicycle, as anyone can prove by listening to a bicycle roll past.

The noise that we're talking about is the turbulence as our pointy ears
hit the wind stream at an angle--we can hear it, but no one else can.
It's an absolutely tiny, trivial noise (you'd have to be Dumbo to make
a noise audible to anyone else by turning your head in the wind), but
it's occurring right next to your ear drum. The huge leverage of
proximity is what magnifies the tiny noise of the breeze rustling past
your ear-lobes.

This is why bicycle helmets can make an audible difference, even though
they don't cover our ears. Things may sound different because the helmet
changes the air flow around your head--just as turning your head
slightly to one side or the other will change the noise.

As a rough guide, however, notice that you can easily talk to other
bicycle riders over this noise. It's no worse than standing on the deck
of a ferry boat, enjoying the breeze, and chatting with a friend.

But just as wind drag increases exponentially with speed, so will wind
noise right in a rider's ear increase as speed rises. This is one
reasons why motorcycle fairings are popular--they cut the wind speed and
reduce the noise. But most bicyclists don't reach 50 mph often enough to
worry about this.

The same is true of headphones on planes. The music may be playing, but
they still muffle some of the roar of the engines.

Carl Fogel



--

Patrick Hansmeier <phan8ic@despammed.com> wrote in message news:<c53brk$ha5$1@nx6.HRZ.Uni-Dortmund.DE>...
> Matthew Thomas wrote:
>
> > Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> > between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
> > damage?
>
> Has anyone researched if drivers of cars, let alone lorries or trucks,
> are deafened permanently by the noise of their vehicles?
>
> > And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
> > wind noise while still being alert to traffic?
>
> Compared to cyclists, passengers of cars hear virtually nothing when it
> comes to 'alertness to traffic'. Maybe you are bothered personally by
> wind noise, but I don't see a reason why one should really care for this.
> However: A wad of cotton wool will supposedly do the trick for you.
>
> Patrick

Dear Patrick,

Truck drivers do indeed suffer hearing problems, but this
is the result of engine noise, not wind noise. Aircraft and
helicopter pilots have the same problem. High-frequency
hearing loss is common around heavy engines, whether they're
cars, planes, motorcycles, lawn mowers, or boats. You can
often spot victims of this damage--they're the fellows who
keep chatting with you, obviously following every word that
you say, but serenely unconscious that their wrist watch
alarms are emitting high-pitched beeps.

(Whether such fellows are married more often than not is an
ugly side of acoustic research that we decline to delve into.)

A vanishing variant of such damage is sometimes called tractor
ear. Farmers with open tractors tend to steer with one hand on
the wheel while half-turned to look over their shoulders
at the plow behind them. One ear is aimed at the noisy tractor
engine for hours, while the other ear is turned away and shielded,
so these fellows sometimes wear a single hearing aid.

Wind noise alone (the turbulence as the air thrashes around
the complicated shape of the ear) isn't likely to be damaging
until you move up in speed to motorcycles--and add the extra
noise of the motorcycle engine on top of the wind.

Carl Fogel

bigmatt888@hotmail.com (Matthew Thomas) wrote in message news:<6c99a27b.0404072049.7e0b2ef@posting.google.com>...
> Does anyone know if there is any research that has found a link
> between the wind noise experienced while riding and permanent hearing
> damage? And if so, does anyone know of a practical solution to reduce
> wind noise while still being alert to traffic?
>
> thanks,
> Matt
>
> salsashark88 "at" hotmail "dot" com

Hi, I'm reasonably careful with my hearing, I wear earplugs when I mow
the lawn, but I don't worry about noise levels when I'm riding.

But on the subject of ears, mine do get cold easily. Anything below
the mid 50s with a 10mph wind and I need to wear an earband. Same with
my foot, I'm in booties and full gloves, while some guy rides by
wearing shorts. Is anyone else more bothered by the cold, than their
riding buddies? Personally, I'd rather be warm than cool[fashionable].
Life is Good!
Jeff

On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 15:50:54 GMT, Werehatrack <rault00@earthWEEDSlink.net>
wrote:

<On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 07:30:25 -0400, William Holiday
<<hattertown@yahoo.com> may have said:
<
<>On Thu, 08 Apr 2004 05:00:30 GMT, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <mikej1@ix.netcom.com>
<>wrote:
<>
<><it seems to me that
<><things are quieter when I'm out riding than when I'm in a car.
<>
<>...until you turn off the Tchaikovsky ;-)
<
<But why would you do that?

Wagner ;-0